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Or he'd just rather not go through all that ridiculous stress again.
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Originally Posted by Greg David
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I fully agree. I think the pains that went into making it show onscreen.



This I don't agree with. What's dated about them? I think everything looks remarkably practical and real. That's one of its strengths.

I guess I'm thinking of the Alien stuff and scenes where Harris is running around on the bottom of the ocean, shortly after Mary Elizabeth dies. But that could just be my mind looking for flaws since I know they're in a abandoned nuclear reactor.

But you're right, the Deep Core sets are pretty great.
I wish that would come out on Blu Ray already. The last DVD release wasn't even anamorphic. I don't want to watch it in a little window in the middle of my TV.
As I posted in the blu-ray thread, the CE coming in November will have a four and a half minute opening that takes place on Earth. I'm interested to see what shape Cameron has the planet in.
The only thing I can think to add to this thread is that the helicopter-geckos were fucking funny. I can scarcely imagine a fictional creature that must hate its own existence more; the entire time that neon-spinny-thing is engaged the rest of the lizard just dangles beneath, wishing it wasn't born a helicopter-gecko.
Yeah, I was baffled by some of the shite creature design in this film... that I at least expected to be impressive, but I was sort of left baffled at how much of it looked like it was designed by a kid on the back of his exercise book.

All the promises of how much Cameron had learnt from exploring the depths of the Ocean and its myriad strange lifeforms seemed to be reduced to glowing plants and floaty things.
Bah! The Goro-inspired wildlife was INSPIRED!

Wild dogs! But with extra arms!

Pterodactyl lizards! But with extra wings!

Rhinos! But with hammerheads!

Either Cameron didn't do the ocean justice... or the ocean is boring!
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Originally Posted by Barkatthemoon
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As I posted in the blu-ray thread, the CE coming in November will have a four and a half minute opening that takes place on Earth. I'm interested to see what shape Cameron has the planet in.

I imagine much like THE ROAD meets BLADERUNNER. You'll recall Worthington said that nothing green lived on earth, that the humans "killed their mother" (mother meaning Gaia)

This too has been something that's fascinated me about AVATAR and I think it will greatly enhance the film to include it. When the shuttle doors open on Pandora and that weird gas exchange wave hits us, that amazing green place should have the same impact on us as it does on Sam, given that we will now know where he came from and what life had been like for him up till that point
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Originally Posted by mcnooj82
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Bah! The Goro-inspired wildlife was INSPIRED!

Wild dogs! But with extra arms!

Pterodactyl lizards! But with extra wings!

Rhinos! But with hammerheads!

Either Cameron didn't do the ocean justice... or the ocean is boring!

You know, that was another problem I had with the film. For a movie that was supposed to be so "out there," it displayed a stunning lack of imagination. Like those horse things. They basically the horses you'd find on Earth, except for the extra set of legs up front...which makes no sense from a biological point of view.
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Originally Posted by Devildoubt
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You know, that was another problem I had with the film. For a movie that was supposed to be so "out there," it displayed a stunning lack of imagination. Like those horse things. They basically the horses you'd find on Earth, except for the extra set of legs up front...which makes no sense from a biological point of view.

IMHO, the creature and plant design was very cool. I do not like the reptile bugs that people flew around on. When you got up close they looked kinda weird I guess, but they felt way too obvious in terms of their appearance

All the other creatures were better, IMHO. I liked that they all had more legs, I think it probably had to do with the lower gravity on Pandora. The horses were kind of neat, they had ant eater heads and breathed through their legs. The breathing on the Pandoran animals was a great touch. I thought that in retrospect the fact the Navi rode horses made the whole manifest destiny allegory a bit on the nose, but whatever

The Toruk design is extremely bad ass though, IMHO. I love the bright orange color!

The spirit trees were very beautiful too

PS You are forgetting the "Hammerhead Rhino" also had decorative feathers like a bird of paradise.
Saw it again, I liked some of the new footage.
I went and saw it in its Special Edition form and I don't think I noticed all of the new footage as out of the stuff I knew was new to the movie, it didn't add up to 8 more minutes of runtime. Still, I got to see it at the giant screen they have at the AMC Theatres at Walt Disney World* so that was nice; while the new footage didn't mean all that much overall, I liked seeing the movie in 3-D again. Not that I'll need to revisit the movie again anytime soon, as heck I've already seen it in Blu-Ray format, and to me it's not a movie I can watch numerous times. Not that there are many movies which I can watch multiple times, but this certainly isn't one of them.

* I never got to watch it on an IMAX screen when it was originally out, and that new ETX screen is almost as large as a legit IMAX screen and it both looks and sounds great, no matter what sort of movie you run on it; at least from one experience I've had, watching a regular movie on an legit IMAX screen is much worse than you'd think it would be.

As an aside, when I watched the Blu-Ray with my old man-someone who really doesn't follow the movie scene at all, and as shocking as it may sound to some, he's even a tougher critic than I am-and he managed to enjoy the movie far more than I would have thought. I mean, he didn't originally want to watch it as he basically knew that it was some sort of giant blue cat-people movie, but he gave it a shot and much to my amazement he liked it. However, the first time the movie showed Sam Worthington, it was in extreme close-up and he actually asked me, "Is that Jean-Claude Van Damme"? Swear to Christ, this is true. I then explained that he was "some Australian dude", which may be the best way to describe him, come to think of it.

You can see what I mean about my father not following the movie scene (but hey, at least he of little current movie knowledge marked out for it), but I'll forever wonder what Avatar would have been like with Van Damme in the lead. I'm sure he would have had more charisma than Worthington, but I don't want this to turn into a session where we all bash him, as I'm sure that's been done in other threads in recent months.
I think the one question we all want answered about the special edition is, do the Na'Vi braid-fuck?
As a matter of fact, you do see their braids tie together.

There isn't too much besides that for "the extended love scene".
I saw the special edition last night and the best new scene is the Navi attack on the bulldozers. They destroyed them and killed the soldiers guarding them. It shows that the Navi are not completely helpless against technology without Jake and helps explain the "fighting terror with terror" line later.

I also enjoyed the hunt scene, it ended perfectly with Jake shouting, "Kickass!" or something like that and then Neytiri shouting the same thing. Got a big laugh from the audience.
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Originally Posted by NoahtheStud
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I also enjoyed the hunt scene, it ended perfectly with Jake shouting, "Kickass!" or something like that and then Neytiri shouting the same thing. Got a big laugh from the audience.

Sounds awful
Yes it does. It sounds like one of those requisite "You're supposed to cheer here" scenes that Cameron loves so much.
I don't know the state of Avatar fandom, how serious it is or isn't, but I wonder if some infortunate looking couple has attempted to emulate the Na'vi "braid-fuck". I would like to meet these people if they exist and then I would like to kill them.
I like that you're angry at people who only theoretically exist.

Odds are, though, they totally exist. And they deserve your anger.
Oh, I'm not angry, just socially conscious and looking to do my part.
I had a weird dream last night that was a mix of Avatar and Finding Nemo. I rarely ever achieve awareness of the dream while I'm dreaming, but I was very conscious of the fact that I was playing a role in a highly derivative dream full of moments where conventions crossed into each other. It was very strange to wake up to. Unaware that it's a dream, but very aware of the fact that I was playing straight into archetypes.

Not a gamechanging dream however. The Finding Nemo portion was better! Hohoho

I love kicking Avatar. I would love to kick some Na'vi.
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Originally Posted by Dan Benenson
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Sounds awful

Yeah, awfully good. It was sold really well by Zoe.
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Originally Posted by NoahtheStud
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Yeah, awfully good. It was sold really well by Zoe.

Well by the Dorito muncher that animated her anyway.
I'll say this, because it's just as good a time as any. Some small part of me, microscopic though it may be, kind of wishes that James Cameron had walked away with Best Director / Best Picture. Not because he deserved it, because he didn't, not because I like the film, because I don't, but because I can't help but be just a little impressed that this fucking guy took a doomsday forecast and turned it into blue skies and sunlight.

People were betting against him, betting hard and hatefully, and he flipped it in the biggest way possible, and for the people that pay attention to these things, broke his own fucking record in the process.

I say a small part of me wishes he would have won because if I were him, when I hit that podium, I wouldn't have said a word, I would have just laughed, and laughed, and fucking laughed, then walked off the stage leaving everyone in stunned silence.

Again, I don't like the film, I don't particularly like 3D, and I'm not the world's biggest Cameron fan either, but if I were a gambling man, I'd walk away from the poker table if I saw Cameron coming my way.

This is not an endorsement, just a gesture, a tip of the hat; even douchebags get those sometimes.
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Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny
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I'll say this, because it's just as good a time as any. Some small part of me, microscopic though it may be, kind of wishes that James Cameron had walked away with Best Director / Best Picture. Not because he deserved it, because he didn't, not because I like the film, because I don't, but because I can't help but be just a little impressed that this fucking guy took a doomsday forecast and turned it into blue skies and sunlight.

People were betting against him, betting hard and hatefully, and he flipped it in the biggest way possible, and for the people that pay attention to these things, broke his own fucking record in the process.

I say a small part of me wishes he would have won because if I were him, when I hit that podium, I wouldn't have said a word, I would have just laughed, and laughed, and fucking laughed, then walked off the stage leaving everyone in stunned silence.

Again, I don't like the film, I don't particularly like 3D, and I'm not the world's biggest Cameron fan either, but if I were a gambling man, I'd walk away from the poker table if I saw Cameron coming my way.

This is not an endorsement, just a gesture, a tip of the hat; even douchebags get those sometimes.

I won't get into the 3D Revolution ETC in this post, I will simply say that I agree with your statement. I was one of the only people publicly predicting that AVATAR would become the new hightest grossing film of all time. The Nay Sayers said that "the box office had fundamentally changed since TITANIC and those kind of figures were no longer possible". It's a special, satisfied feeling to know that on a given issue you really did have more insight than everyone else, and I kind of feel like in some small way (because, ultimately, something as trivial as the OSCARS can't detract from the astonishing scale of Comrade Cameron's cinematic victory) he was cheated from that much deserved moment in the spotlight, his chance to stand in front of Hollywood and have them acknowledge on live television his unparalleled genius. Everyone in that room is on any given day of the year working towards one goal: to make the most successful movie of all time. Cameron, out of the wilderness of more than 10 years without a film returns and shows them that he alone possesses a unique insight into the future of cinema and the audience's psyche. No one present in the Kodak Theater that night could ever dare to even hope to one day match Cameron's feat, and so at long last rather than deign to award him their little statue they *hilariously* pretend that it's art that's most important at the Academy Awards. I'm just glad that THL got the chance to enter the storied pantheon reserved for only the Academy's most deserving films. In the company of monumental classics like RETURN OF THE KING, AMERICAN BEAUTY and CRASH alone should the THL reside
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Originally Posted by Princess Kate
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I won't get into the 3D Revolution ETC in this post, I will simply say that I agree with your statement. I was one of the only people publicly predicting that AVATAR would become the new hightest grossing film of all time. The Nay Sayers said that "the box office had fundamentally changed since TITANIC and those kind of figures were no longer possible". It's a special, satisfied feeling to know that on a given issue you really did have more insight than everyone else, and I kind of feel like in some small way (because, ultimately, something as trivial as the OSCARS can't detract from the astonishing scale of Comrade Cameron's cinematic victory) he was cheated from that much deserved moment in the spotlight, his chance to stand in front of Hollywood and have them acknowledge on live television his unparalleled genius. Everyone in that room is on any given day of the year working towards one goal: to make the most successful movie of all time. Cameron, out of the wilderness of more than 10 years without a film returns and shows them that he alone possesses a unique insight into the future of cinema and the audience's psyche. No one present in the Kodak Theater that night could ever dare to even hope to one day match Cameron's feat, and so at long last rather than deign to award him their little statue they *hilariously* pretend that it's art that's most important at the Academy Awards. I'm just glad that THL got the chance to enter the storied pantheon reserved for only the Academy's most deserving films. In the company of monumental classics like RETURN OF THE KING, AMERICAN BEAUTY and CRASH alone should the THL reside

Unparalleled genius? Comrade Cameron's Cinematic Victory? The most successful movie of all time? Unique insight to the future of cinema and the audience's psyche? No one present in the theater that night could ever dare to match Cameron's feat?

Are you shitting me? Are you fucking shitting me?

God. Take his cock out of your mouth for a few minutes and read your post.
Unless you are of course James Cameron, then wipe up your splooge off the keyboard and pay attention.

I have no issue with Johnny's statement, but where the fuck do you get off?

Look, it was a risk that paid off despite some hefty odds. The 3d filming was interesting, and did lend itself to the success of the film. But that does not make Avatar some kind of perfect film. Dear god. BladeRunner? The Godfather? Seven Samurai? Sunrise. Citizen Kane. Fuck, Gone with the Wind. These are victories. Hell, I'd even throw the LotR series and the Harry Potters in there. Heck, The Thing, The Exorcist, Jaws...9 1/2. The Searchers. GoodFellas. These are pieces of art, even if you don't like them. These films changed cinema in a way that Cameron will never be able to emulate. Pick any one of these, and I'm pretty damn sure any of them are more successful as films than Avatar could ever hope to be. Most of them say something, or symbolize something that Avatar can never hope to obtain, because there is nothing Avatar says beyond "pretty picture, whiteman bad."

How fucking shortsighted are you to measure a film's 'success' by dollars fucking earned? That is the only way Avatar could even admit to succeeding. It has no other claims to greatness beyond being an expensive, lightheaded genre flick.

Cameron's got skills as a director of action. He's thorough and talented, competent even. But no matter how shiny this film is, it will be nothing more than a footnote in box office gross records in a few years. I know it has faded from my memory, whereas the superior District 9, which relies on real innovation, will be remembered beyond its profit. I don't know how much worth the Oscars have, but this is far from the kind of art that deserves such slavish adoration.

Just fuck. How fucking much are you getting paid to ....


Just fuck this, man. I am so boggled by your damn post.
I have such a massive crush on Wayward right now.
Somehow, Wayward managed to avoid most of Kate's posts until now (how!?) and got a full blast of it in this thread. She looked into the sun and... you know the rest.
Putting Kate back on ignore did wonders for my blood pressure. Wayward, I suggest you do the same, although it IS awesome to watch you She-Hulk out.
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Originally Posted by Greg Clark
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Putting Kate back on ignore did wonders for my blood pressure. Wayward, I suggest you do the same, although it IS awesome to watch you She-Hulk out.

She's been ignore for me since she got here and I usually get annoyed when people quote her - but if the quotes were all followed by epic smackdowns like that one I wouldn't mind so much.
This is once again in violation of the NEW RULES. wayward was on topic and I will respond to her tomorrow. Devin decreed that discussions such as the one GC and TRD are engaging in are verboten and subject to TIME OUT under the NEW RULES.
Let the Mods worry about rule enforcement, Kate.
unfortunately Devin is not here anymore..so it's like Mad Max all up in here.

I still believe that True Lies is Cameron's best work
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Originally Posted by Patrick Ripoll
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Let the Mods worry about rule enforcement, Kate.

I will do that going forward, Patrick. However, Greg Clark is the one who accused me of violating the NEW RULES in Devin's absence because I was posting on topic images. That was why I pointed it out
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Originally Posted by The Rain Dog
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Well by the Dorito muncher that animated her anyway.

Nah, it was mostly a verbal moment and the infectious enthusiasm in her voice sold it for me.