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GODZILLA 2014 Post Release Discussion - Printable Version

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+--- Thread: GODZILLA 2014 Post Release Discussion (/showthread.php?tid=150689)

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- Nooj - 10-05-2014

AONGH SO GOOD.

SO LIVELY AND INFORMATIVE

ALL HAIL DAVID KALAT


- freeman - 10-05-2014

AYou leave this movie alone. You are only allowed to Nooj splooge all over Amazing Spider Douche if you leave the good movies alone.


- Nooj - 10-05-2014

ANo I don't think so.


- cccc - 10-05-2014

This thread hasn't change.  The movie is still wonderful and Nooj still can't get passed it.




- Nooj - 10-05-2014

AIt's PAST it, you fool!!!


- cccc - 10-05-2014

Oops.  Keep it on subject you poop.




- ska oreo - 10-05-2014

Haha. I think Mcnooj might implode for being wrong.



so, so wrong.




- shaun h - 10-05-2014

ASorry I wasn't here to help defend you, nooj. I kept clicking on this thread and the mere mention of this movie sent me to nappy time.


- Nooj - 10-05-2014

Aeh no biggie

Kinda similar to this movie.

A piffle.


- jacknifejohnny - 10-05-2014

A[quote name="avian" url="/community/t/150689/godzilla-2014-post-release-discussion/1150#post_3784137"]Batman Begins: Man, we only got to see one decent Batman fight, this sucks!

Godzilla 2014: Man, we only got to see one decent Godzilla fight, this rules!
[/quote]

False. There aren't any good fights in Batman Begins. Nolan had an excuse for it, something about Alien and seeing Batman from the criminal's perspective. Might be a failed experiment, or just a cover because he realized his star was mummified in a poorly designed costume.

Sorry for the derail, please continue the ongoing debate about Destructosaurus: The Atomic-Lizard from Okinawa.


- cylon baby - 10-05-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcnooj82 View Post



A piffle.



No you're a piffle!




- Nooj - 10-06-2014

AThen you must love me as you love this piffle film!


- freeman - 10-06-2014




But also...  Shuddap.




- Nooj - 10-06-2014

Ano way col.


- freeman - 10-06-2014

I was hoping I wouldn't have to do this...  OKAY.



"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides..."




- Nooj - 10-06-2014

AWhat're you doing?


- freeman - 10-06-2014

Would you just let me finish?  It's a really cool cold as ice thing to say to somebody before...  Before I take them off to live on a beautiful movie farm where there's screenings of Amazing all day and all night and bottomless popcorn and an outdoor drive through with amazing picture quality, forever and ever.



*Loads shotgun, whilst crying*



It'll be OK, boy.  It's going to be fine.




- Codename - 10-06-2014

Never has a mediocre film inspired such passionate defenders and detractors since... well, Man of Steel probably.




- freeman - 10-06-2014

How fucking DARE you come into this thread, MY THREAD, and try to compare Godzilla to Man Of Steel.  How DARE you?



Godzilla, even if you didn't like it, was going for something.  It was trying hard to do something, and even if you don't think it succeeded or it had boring characters or WHATEVER...  It was a genuine, loving attempt my people who are talented and smart.  It committed to this Jurassic Park/ Jaws approach 100 percent.  It was doing a thing.



Man Of Steel is a cynical mis guided and lousy attempt at a beloved franchise by people who are talented and...  Talented.  But instead of using something that makes sense, for example framing Godzilla in the shadow of Spielbergs monster movie classics with some pretty obvious nods...  They chose to rip off Terrence Mallick.  Why?  To use Mallicks emotionally engaging sense of storytelling to make you engage with Kal and see him as human, instead of this shiny unrelatable God?  Well, that didn't really work out because they didn't bring Tree of Life's storytelling, just it's cinematography.



Even if I had hated Godzilla I would have sat back and respected it for getting the basic choices right.  Man of Steel didn't get that far in the conceptual phase.




- freeman - 10-06-2014




- Codename - 10-06-2014

Well yeah,  both movies are going for something specific.  And both fail to succeed in those attempts to relatively comparable degrees.



The Jaws comparison always gets brought up with regards to Godzilla, which is a fine thing to try and emulate but where Jaws had a highly engaging protagonist in Sheriff Brody, Godzilla only had Cranston for the first half-hour before moving into bland ville.  It would be like if Sheriff Brody got killed in the first shark attack and we had to follow his son around while Quint and Hooper get side-lined for boring exposition.



And that's where Godzilla's problems are.  Teasing the titular monster till a big reveal in the end is a great approach to take!  But when the characters you are supposed to care for during all this teasing fail to connect, it can (and does) really feel like a slog to get to that inevitable payoff.



And Man of Steel has a lot of those same problems.  On paper it has an interesting take on the character of Superman.  Showing how he would relate to the modern world and how that same world reacts to him is a great premise that, again, gets bungled and lost in the writing.  It's difficult to care for the character of Clark and the trials he endures when you can't connect with him.



Both films have noble intentions that get lost due to problems with the writing and characterisations.  And both only really come alive when the heavily CG'd action is on screen.



But I don't want to turn yet another thread into a MoS/Nolan Batfilm discussion.  My original comparison was that both are mediocre films that seem to inspire a lot of heated defending/detracting based mostly on nostalgia and love for the respective source materials.




- Codename - 10-06-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freeman View Post
 


How dare I?!  HOW DARE YOOOOU!




- Nooj - 10-06-2014

ACodename is wise.

Codename is diviiiine!!!

And yes, both films are middling on their own. On their own, I wouldn't make much a big deal.

My "hate schtick" only comes in response to the praise directed at these movies I find to be middling.

Man of Steel was way worse by nature of such inane defenses for the film's many many faults.

At least with Godzilla, even its supporters will agree about my primary qualms with the film.

But should anyone dare to continue feeding the misconception that Ford Brody works because he's such a 'normal guy trying to do the right thing'...

(sharpens knives)


- Codename - 10-06-2014

He's a completely normal guy who also magically gets entangled in every single MUTO/Godzilla encounter all across the world.  Because normal.



He's also the best bomb disposal guy in the world...unless the cover of the bomb gets cracked.  Then you are shit outta luck!




- freeman - 10-06-2014

The part that annoys me is where two flawed films are placed on the same qualitative pedestal as Godzilla, because that's fucking absurd.  I know I know I know it doesn't matter and I know it's subjective semantics and so on but to me it's comparing a movie that failed to a movie that didn't shine and sparkle.  That's a BIG difference. A Godzilla sized difference.  Not to mention the character stuff gets way blown out of proportion.  I mean, ignoring the "there's no fighting!" complaint entirely it's the number one reason people don't like the film.  Human characters sucked.  Why though?  He's a likable, responsible moral soldier who just wants to be back with his family, but not as the expense of his responsibilities.  He protects a kid.  He volunteers for dangerous missions.  He's a like able, A-OK dude.  Just some Johnson doesn't have the gift of being able to make taking a dump look interesting like Cranston can doesn't mean he did a poor job.  Not every performance in every movie has to be larger than life charismatic and interesting.



I know we've covered this plenty, but I guess I don't get why you guys didn't care about these characters and I did.  There's more than enough reasons to like them, and their stories don't leave you writhing in your seats in the agony of boredom because something is always happening along side it.  A mystery is being solved.  A death is being delt with.  A plan is being hatched, etc.




- freeman - 10-06-2014

This thread right now is just a sane person with good taste shirtlessly wrestling with two rapid hyenas.






- Nooj - 10-06-2014

ASame reasons as Pacific Rim.

No drama. Dramatic craft, that is.

Except in Pacific Rim's case, it was trying SO hard to do drama. It was just really really bad at it and overstuffed with the illusion of drama.

The moment Cranston's overwrought drama leaves (MY WIIIIIIIIFE!!!!), the movie is left with none aside from what could be seen as a non-character that just moves from one disaster to another and doesn't seem to ever feel any one way about it.

If you're completely engaged by the thrill of a Godzilla movie being done with awe and respect, I assume one could easily project themselves onto that utter void of a character.

That wasn't enough for me.

The movie seemed to be hinting at a possible drama of a man torn between duty and being with his family.

But HOLY MOLY did that not ever come to anything.


- freeman - 10-06-2014

There's plenty of classic genre films with characters who have less going on.  It's a valid complaint that he doesn't have enough going on.  But it also allllllmost counts as a nitpick.




- Nooj - 10-06-2014

AI don't care that he doesn't have 'enough' going on.

There is elegance in simplicity. A well told story can make simplicity compelling. Chief Brody was just a family man scared of the water who was trying to do the right thing. Except he gets to be a part of a triumvirate with Quint and Hooper.

What little was in Godzilla was done so badly that it may as well not been there at all.

This movie's problem is that it's done with the cadence of a character drama. But there were no characters after Cranston died.

That casual FEMA guy is a really good stand-in for the level of character in this movie.

This is not a nitpick. I'm on the verge of calling you a nincompoop for thinking that it is.


- Codename - 10-06-2014

Sure, not every character needs to pop out of the screen and be the most interesting and charismatic force in the world.  But when you are the sole protagonist who gets the majority of screen time in a movie that's over two hours long...you kind of have to be A BIT interesting.



A lot of the complaints about the character can probably be lain at Johnson's feet but as it stands, it's like none of these events seem to bother him much at all.  If he is supposed to be our audience connective character it would be nice to see him react to these worldview changing creatures with literally ANYTHING other than blank faced open mouth stares.  Near the end of the movie he actually pulls a fucking handgun on the Momma MUTO and looks like he earnestly thinks that would help!



And this would probably not be such an issue if at least, SOME of the other characters (with much more talented actors) actually had more to do than drop exposition the whole time.



You can have a bland character like Luke Skywalker because he's counter-balanced by someone like Han Solo.  But Godzilla puts all it's apples in the Ford basket and expect that to carry the whole fucking movie.  And that is where you fail Godzilla.  Ford as part of an ensemble would have been fine.  But being the sole protagonist was what killed this beast.




- freeman - 10-06-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcnooj82 View Post

I don't care that he doesn't have 'enough' going on.

There is elegance in simplicity. A well told story can make simplicity compelling.

What was here was done so badly that it may as well not been there at all.

This movie's problem is that it's done with the cadence of a character drama. But there were no characters after Cranston died.

That casual FEMA guy is a really good stand-in for the level of character in this movie.

This is not a nitpick. I'm on the verge of calling you a nincompoop for thinking that it is.

Why was it "done so badly?"  Break it down, because I'm calling bullshit.  It was fine.  Wasn't exceptional, but was completely fine.  You're the nincompoop here who's being influenced by his own skit.




- freeman - 10-06-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by Codename View Post

But Godzilla puts all it's apples in the Ford basket and expect that to carry the whole fucking movie.


Oh my God no it fucking doesn't.  Maybe you forgot because you were so lost in your hatred, but this is a giant monster movie starring a giant monster.  The biggest moments in the film are all about spending decent chunks of time building up to the monsters.  They are what matters.




- Nooj - 10-06-2014

AI mean Freeman is the guy who thinks that having an issue with cutting away from a life-or-death hanging-from-a-tram-with-one-arm-while-holding-a-child-with-the-other moment and showing them safe and sound the next money is a mere

NITPICK.

Forget it. I AM gonna call you a nincompoop.


- Nooj - 10-06-2014

A[quote name="Freeman" url="/community/t/150689/godzilla-2014-post-release-discussion/1200#post_3784632"]Oh my God no it fucking doesn't.  Maybe you forgot because you were so lost in your hatred, but this is a giant monster movie starring a giant monster.  The biggest moments in the film are all about spending decent chunks of time building up to the monsters.  They are what matters.
[/quote]

Who cares about the build up when there are no characters to build up the monsters towards? Without characters, it's just sequences of well-done spectacle.

What we have is just some blanks and exposition vessels that respond in animal fear (or awe in Watanabe's case). That's good for a scene, but you need some more than that to stretch it to 2 hours.


- freeman - 10-06-2014




I can't believe that once I called you out on it and you decided to shamelessly divert attention from your wrongness, you chose THAT example.  He caught the kid, and they climbed up and then went to the nearest emergency support ladder and climbed down.  That would make for a very exciting short montage I'll give you that, but the important part of the scene(The danger) was over.  Do you get mad every time a scene cuts in the theater once the danger is gone and they just cut away to the aftermath?  Because it happens a lot.