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Fantasy Flight Star Wars: Edge of the Empire & X-WIng Miniatures

Oh I have no doubt they'll add two Last Jedi ships -- probably the TIE Silencer and the new A-Wing -- to Wave XII for X-Wing.  There are two missing SKUs in the product line, and they did the same thing with the new X-Wing and TIE Fighter from TFA two years ago.

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FFG just announced X-Wing 2.0.  The highlights:
  • Imperial, Rebel and Scum & Villainy at launch, First Order and Resistance coming as separate factions in first wave of expansions (so five factions total)
  • All factions rebuilt from the ground up to have better, more distinct identities
  • Force abilities will be part of the game
  • Conversion kits will be available for each faction
  • Cards will no longer have point costs or upgrade slots; all squad building to be done via a companion app
  • It seems all ships are getting some form of the bullseye arc, and the 360 turrets are getting some form of the mobile arc from the Shadowcaster
  • Changes coming to how actions work
  • Medium base ships introduced
  • The two announced expansions will have components for both editions
  • Early release at GenCon
Having been in a bit of a lull on this game, I have to admit this has really amped up my excitement.
My karmic debt must be huge.

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My blog: An Embarrassment of Rich's
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Meh...not really thrilled at the idea of "Buy all the same stuff all over again!" But it makes sense...they were running out of product to make. Armada already seems to have stalled out, too.
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Well, you don't have to buy everything again; the conversion kits contain enough components for 2 or 3 of each ship in the faction. Of course, a lot of us have a LOT more than 2 or 3 of each ship, but honestly, I don't think I ever flew more than 3 of anything outside of epic games (which weren't addressed in the panel from what I've read). Still, the conversion kits are $50 a pop, and you also have to buy a core set to get the new damage deck and maneuver templates, so you're looking at at least $190 to convert. Cheaper than buying all new ships by a long sight, though.
My karmic debt must be huge.

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My blog: An Embarrassment of Rich's
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Yep, and that’s where FFG has lost me as a customer.  Unless you’ve got a group of local friends determined to stick with the old version, you’re now getting extorted out of nearly $200 to keep playing a game you may well have dropped several hundred bucks if not more on.

It’s not as easy to just stick with the older edition as a tabletop RPG, where the experience is usually at home among friends.  Mini wargames are more centered around the shop experience, where everyone is generally expected to play the latest and greatest.

Also hello massive price jump on the basic set.
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I don't know; when Sony or Microsoft announce a new PlayStation or XBox, you're essentially dropping $400 or $500 to buy into the new system, and people can't wait to do it. And I'd say six years is a pretty damn good run for a miniatures game. The game was beginning to show signs of strain and really needed a refresh that I don't think simply refurbishing the old game would have accomplished.
My karmic debt must be huge.

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My blog: An Embarrassment of Rich's
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(05-01-2018, 09:12 PM)Richard Dickson Wrote: I don't know; when Sony or Microsoft announce a new PlayStation or XBox, you're essentially dropping $400 or $500 to buy into the new system, and people can't wait to do it.  And I'd say six years is a pretty damn good run for a miniatures game.  The game was beginning to show signs of strain and really needed a refresh that I don't think simply refurbishing the old game would have accomplished.

Yeah, but most mini games still let you use your old minis without having to pay a toll as your loyalty reward.  Sure, they bring out new versions, but they don't mandate that you use those new models of old units on the table, short of the rare occasion that they ban/remove certain units from the game entirely.  I could, in theory, slap an army of 1st Edition WH40K Space Marines on the table and use them in 2573rd edition or whatever they're on now.

Likewise chances are a new Playstation or XBox will have some degree of backward-compatibility either at launch or not too long afterwards, and you probably won't have to pay extra to unlock it.  Or conversely you can keep your old system right alongside it as long as you've got enough ports on your TV, and once again the company isn't going to charge you $200 to keep playing games on it once the new system is out.

So basically, poor analogies there.

I'm not resentful of the fact they're making a second edition in the least.  I'm resentful of the fact that they're rewarding long-term customers with the privilege of spending extra money just so they can continue using the product they've given FFG hundreds if not thousands of dollars for already (The actual ship minis).  It's a supremely shitty move, IMO, and this would be an entirely different conversation if the "conversion kits" were offered at cost or even a bit of a loss for FFG, more so if they were provided free, though I realize the latter is not a realistic expectation.
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Yes, you could use your first edition Warhammer figures in the current game. But only after you spend about $200 for the new rules and codexes and templates.
My karmic debt must be huge.

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My blog: An Embarrassment of Rich's
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(05-01-2018, 10:37 PM)Richard Dickson Wrote: Yes, you could use your first edition Warhammer figures in the current game.  But only after you spend about $200 for the new rules and codexes and templates.

And once again, having to buy a new box set/rules doesn't bother me.  Having to effectively pay an extra "loyalty tax" to use my old minis bothers me.  I get it, FFG's probably not gonna make a lot of money on old players buying repackaged minis for the new edition, so they've gotta milk that audience for more than the Box sets and the trickle of actually new minis somehow.  It's just business, etc... etc...

But it's still shitty to their existing customer base, IMO.
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Someone posted the number of ships covered in each conversion kit:

Rebel Alliance Conversion Kit

3 – A-wing
2 – ARC-170
2 – Auzituck Gunship
2 – B-wing
2 – E-wing
2 – Ghost
2 – HWK-290
2 – K-wing
2 – Millennium Falcon
2 – Phantom I
2 – Phantom II
2 – Sabine’s TIE Fighter
2 – U-wing
2 – X-wing
2 – Y-wing
2 – YT-2400
4 – Z-95 Headhunter

Galactic Empire Conversion Kit

2 – Alpha-class Star Wing
3 – Inquisitor’s TIE
2 – Lambda-class Shuttle
2 – TIE Advanced
3 – TIE Aggressor
3 – TIE Bomber
2 – TIE Defender
4 – TIE Fighter
3 – TIE Interceptor
2 – TIE Phantom
2 – TIE Punisher
3 – TIE Striker
3 – VT-49 Decimator

Scum and Villainy Conversion Kit

2 – Hound’s Tooth
2 – HWK-290
2 – IG-2000
3 – Kihraxz Fighter
2 – Kimogila Fighter
4 – M3-A Interceptor
2 – Mist Hunter
3 – Protectorate Starfighter
2 – Punishing One
3 – Quadjumper
2 – Scurrg H-6 Bomber
2 – Shadow Caster
2 – Slave I
2 – StarViper
2 – Y-wing
4 – Z-95 Headhunter

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They actually updated the Imperial list, it's 3 StarWings and 2 Decimators.

(05-02-2018, 06:21 AM)jmacq1 Wrote:
(05-01-2018, 10:37 PM)Richard Dickson Wrote: Yes, you could use your first edition Warhammer figures in the current game.  But only after you spend about $200 for the new rules and codexes and templates.

And once again, having to buy a new box set/rules doesn't bother me.  Having to effectively pay an extra "loyalty tax" to use my old minis bothers me. 

But isn't that the same thing?  Buying new rules/box sets to use your old minis or buying new cards/tokens to use your old minis.  What's the difference?
My karmic debt must be huge.

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My blog: An Embarrassment of Rich's
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I will tell you, from a competitive standpoint, 2.0 is the fix for what ails the game. It is rebalanced, turrets are done better, some ambiguity has been cut out, and ships fly differently. The action economy and thematic changes are excellent. As the Game of Thrones people say, the thematic elements are more Nedly. The streamlined initiative (formerly pilot skill) and a lack of Veteran Instincts means decisions on that front matter. The ability of devs to change point values and slots for balance purposes fixes an issue Xwing has long dealt with. The KWing, the Jumpmaster, and Nym are all ship platforms that were undercosted and over equipped with dials that actively supported the worse aspects of the game (turrets, arc dodging, high PS, little opposition response).

Now, does that mean all those sweet alt-arts I won in the past year (Including the rather rare Miranda Doni spot gloss plastic card) are not worthless? Yes, but I am okay with that. It will cost me 200 hundred dollars to get back into 2.0, but I spend that nearly yearly on Xwing product. I spend more going to events for Xwing.
"Wilford Brimley can't be bothered to accept praise. He doesn't act because he thinks people will enjoy his work. He acts because it's his goddamned job." --Will Harris, AV Club
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(05-02-2018, 08:07 PM)Richard Dickson Wrote:
(05-02-2018, 06:21 AM)jmacq1 Wrote:
(05-01-2018, 10:37 PM)Richard Dickson Wrote: Yes, you could use your first edition Warhammer figures in the current game.  But only after you spend about $200 for the new rules and codexes and templates.

And once again, having to buy a new box set/rules doesn't bother me.  Having to effectively pay an extra "loyalty tax" to use my old minis bothers me. 

But isn't that the same thing?  Buying new rules/box sets to use your old minis or buying new cards/tokens to use your old minis.  What's the difference?

What world do you live in where $50 is the same as $200?

As you so kindly pointed out, in this instance I'm required to buy the new rules/box sets AND pay the "loyalty tax" (buy the conversion kits) in addition to that.  It's the second part that pisses me off.  No, they are not the same thing. It's the difference between $50 and up to $200 of expenditure (or maybe $300 if they price the First Order and Resistance conversions the same, but that seems unlikely unless FFG really are greedy morons), and for someone that doesn't have so much disposable income that they don't have to concern themselves with how they spend it (especially when they have varied leisure interests) that makes a significant difference. 

Good on you if you're still on board, but you're not going to convince me the conversion kit pricing isn't a dick move by FFG.
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