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Bill Cosby: Comedian/rapist
#71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fraid uh noman View Post

Maybe I am projecting. But I assure you that I didn't want this to be true as much as anyone. I'd always admired him greatly. But it all just seems....and I realize the can of worms I'm opening by saying "seems"....more and more believable. He's not even vocally defending HIMSELF over utterly horrible and evil accusations of just about the worst kind. Considering his reputation he should have come out swinging on this and declaring innocence in every medium possible to reach as many readers/listeners as possible. But he's just sticking his head in the sand and hoping it'll go away or something. Those don't seem like the actions of an innocent man who's currently having his legacy systematically dismantled. And bizarrely, there's been virtually no one coming to his defense on this. I don't know, man...I'm constructing the narrative that makes me feel not good at all..


Again, people are constructing narratives to suit their feelings.  Cosby is guilty because he's not acting like an innocent man.  Okay.  What does an innocent man act like?  There have been guilty men who ravenously defend themselves, so what would it actually mean if Cosby did that?  It's just another part of the narrative.



The only proper thing is to let the courts handle stuff like this, because that's what they're designed for...actual justice.  Seeing as how it's far too late (these allegations are decades old), there's really nothing left to do except hang Cosby out to dry because he might have raped some women...

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#72
AI may have constructed a narrative but I didn't do it to suit my feelings. If I did that I'd be defending his innocence because I loved the guy. And if it somehow comes out that this was all a bunch of fabrications I'll be first in line to say that I'm beyond pleased that he's not the person he's currently portrayed in the media to be. But this is not one man's word against one woman's. It's one man's word against MANY women. I'm not saying GUILTY. But it looks bad and he's not helping himself whatsoever..
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#73
AAt worst, Cosby is a serial rapist and a sociopath who is incapable of empathy.

At best, he is super awkward with women and there's been a lot of "misunderstandings".

I don't believe any other option outside of these borders.
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#74
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fraid uh noman View Post

I may have constructed a narrative but I didn't do it to suit my feelings. If I did that I'd be defending his innocence because I loved the guy. And if it somehow comes out that this was all a bunch of fabrications I'll be first in line to say that I'm beyond pleased that he's not the person he's currently portrayed in the media to be. But this is not one man's word against one woman's It's one man's word against many women. I'm not saying GUILTY. But it looks bad and he's not helping himself whatsoever..


This isn't to cast blame on you or tell you you're wrong, but you feel he's guilty because of the number of women and his lack of defense...so those are your feelings...that's what I was getting at.



Anyway, internet mob mentality is such a waste of energy.  I'd say people are better off spending their time on more worthwhile endeavors.  Because if he's guilty, he doesn't deserve this much attention.

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#75
A[quote name="Ambler" url="/community/t/152192/bill-cosby-comedian-rapist/60#post_3806585"]

Anyway, internet mob mentality is such a waste of energy.  I'd say people are better off spending their time on more worthwhile endeavors.  Because if he's guilty, he doesn't deserve this much attention.
[/quote]

If he's guilty and continues to tour and sell out shows and doesn't have any consequences from his actions, he deserves all our attention.
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#76

It's not the fact that people are going to his shows that bother me.  I read an article the other day where a sourced person, who gave their name and everything said something along the lines of "I'm just here for his comedy, his personal life isn't any of my business!"



*Facepalm*



I hate hate HATE with a passion the culture of looking the other way.  It isn't innocent until proven guilty, it's "these women are liars and bad people" or "I just don't see it, and because of that there's no way he did it!"



Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck this attitude.

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#77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jmurdoch View Post

If he's guilty and continues to tour and sell out shows and doesn't have any consequences from his actions, he deserves all our attention.


The consequence is (if he's guilty), he's already lost millions in deals as people and networks drop him like a bad habit, and his reputation as America's dad is completely destroyed (regardless of his sold out shows) and he's become the face of rape.  So again, people are better off spending their time on other things.

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#78
Quote:

Originally Posted by Freeman View Post
 

It's not the fact that people are going to his shows that bother me.  I read an article the other day where a sourced person, who gave their name and everything said something along the lines of "I'm just here for his comedy, his personal life isn't any of my business!"



*Facepalm*



I hate hate HATE with a passion the culture of looking the other way.  It isn't innocent until proven guilty, it's "these women are liars and bad people" or "I just don't see it, and because of that there's no way he did it!"



Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck this attitude.




Pretty much my opinion.   It takes as much effort to assume the woman is telling the truth as it does that the man is.   The fact is that most statistics point to, at best, an 8% chance the woman is making it up or a 2% chance in other studies.   Let's say it's even more likely to happen if the man is famous and it goes up to 25-40%.   That still doesn't explain why none of his friends are coming out and defending him.   When Woody Allen was involved in that pedophilia scandal, people came out of the woodwork in support of him.   Crickets when it comes to Cosby.   As I said earlier in this thread, this points to nobody who knows Cosby being surprised by this news.

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#79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambler View Post
 


Again, people are constructing narratives to suit their feelings.  Cosby is guilty because he's not acting like an innocent man.  Okay.  What does an innocent man act like?  There have been guilty men who ravenously defend themselves, so what would it actually mean if Cosby did that?  It's just another part of the narrative.


Well Ambler here is the thing, it's one thing when it's he said/she said. However this time it's 14 hers say/he said which is a bit different. I understand when it's one or even a couple coming at the same time, with the same attorney, suing for money. I am well aware there is a real racket out there where you accuse wealthy and or famous people of something and then go after their money and im also aware that famous and or wealthy people do some fucked up shit because they think they are untouchable. At a certain point you do have to look at the odds but more so what they stand to gain from it and the people themselves involved.



Im betting you don't have the same opinion about the Michael Brown case. Technically there is no evidence that the cop is guilty right? Sure the story of him randomly going for the gun, running off and then  after being shot at came charging back like a bull seems like bullshit but the autopsy can't disprove it. And yes there are a bunch of witnesses but as you know witness testimony can be bad and because they are from Ferguson maybe they are simply telling lies to make the cop look bad? And supposedly there are even witnesses who saw the opposite. Now what do I believe? I think the cop is wrong and he is covering his ass. And why? Because his story while technically possible is certainly unlikely and counter to typical human behavior. And im sure that is the conclusion you came to as well. Is that just ours and the protesters narrative?? Well look at this case, which seems more likely, that 14 women all came together over the course of many years to fuck with Bill Cosby for NO MONEY and a tiny tiny bit of fame or that he is guilty?

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#80
Quote:
Originally Posted by Waaaaaaaalt View Post


Im betting you don't have the same opinion about the Michael Brown case. Technically there is no evidence that the cop is guilty right? Sure the story of him randomly going for the gun, running off and then after being shot at came charging back like a bull seems like bullshit but the autopsy can't disprove it. And yes there are a bunch of witnesses but as you know witness testimony can be bad and because they are from Ferguson maybe they are simply telling lies to make the cop look bad? And supposedly there are even witnesses who saw the opposite. Now what do I believe? I think the cop is wrong and he is covering his ass. And why? Because his story while technically possible is certainly unlikely and counter to typical human behavior. And im sure that is the conclusion you came to as well. Is that just ours and the protesters narrative??



First off, I don't have an opinion about Cosby.  I am not pro, or nay...for the reasons I've specified.



Second, Ferguson isn't related because there's tangible evidence involved, timelines, videos, etc...Cosby's stuff literally has nothing but heresay (decades old heresay...30, 40, even 50 years ago).



Third, if you have an opinion, you've created a narrative to support it, one way or another.  Irrefutable proof doesn't require opinion.  And the judicial process doesn't involve twitter, thank God.

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#81
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambler View Post
 

Second, Ferguson isn't related because there's tangible evidence involved, timelines, videos, etc...Cosby's stuff literally has nothing but heresay (decades old heresay...30, 40, even 50 years ago). 


Which have all been explained away by a bullshit story from the cop. However everything that cop said is possible but completely unfuckinglikely. The evidence doesn't disprove his silly never happened story but again judging what we know about common sense and human behavior we don't buy the cops story. So again everyone just has to ask themselves which is more likely. You will certainly do that in Ferguson but and if i asked you to do that here.......

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#82

Before everyone jumps on the "Cosby must be guilty" wagon, you might reflect on another, very public "Rape Case" that turned out to be a hoax:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tawana_Braw...llegations

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#83
Quote:

Originally Posted by Cylon Baby View Post
 

Before everyone jumps on the "Cosby must be guilty" wagon, you might reflect on another, very public "Rape Case" that turned out to be a hoax:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tawana_Braw...llegations


Ohh im well aware of that and it's part of the reason I think Al Sharpton might not be the greatest guy in the world. However in her case it was still only 1 person. You give me 14 girls getting together and accussing a guy and then we will talk.

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#84
AMeanwhile in the UK...

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/...are_btn_tw

And (including murder)

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5413/m...ch-officer

Jeezus christ. Thats some next level dark shit.
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#85

Quote:


Originally Posted by Cylon Baby View Post
 

Before everyone jumps on the "Cosby must be guilty" wagon, you might reflect on another, very public "Rape Case" that turned out to be a hoax:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tawana_Braw...llegations


And, ironically, Cosby was a supporter of hers.

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#86

Jesus Christ people, 14 women. Many of whom are successful and have nothing to gain because the statute of limitations for either criminal charges or civil suits is way past.

I might have been born yesterday sir, but I stayed up all night!
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#87

Did he rape anyone in Louisiana?  There is no Statute of limitations in that state from what I understand.

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#88
Ahttp://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/...story.html

A detailed article of each account. Tough read.
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#89

Gawker (I know, I know) had a story about Carla Ferrigno's alleged encounter with Cosby.



There's a comment there well worth posting. Here it is:




Quote:

For all the people asking, (or thinking) "Why were Bill Cosby's accusers so quiet about this until now?" Here is my response...



The cost of telling these kinds of stories is higher than you could possibly imagine. If you come forward as a victim of sexual assault, prepare to be bombarded with questions like: Why did you put yourself in that position? Why were you stupid enough to wear that dress/take those pills? Why didn't you fight him off? Etc. etc. victim-blaming etc.



God forbid you're a nobody, because then you're only doing this for your fifteen minutes of fame, or for the money, or for attention. God forbid you're a public figure, because then your own accomplishments will be overshadowed by the worst thing that has ever happened to you; a Google search of your name will turn up RAPE RAPE RAPE, which is exactly the sort of thing you want to be associated with, forever.



From that moment on, you will cease being a person and become a "victim" in the minds of the public (whether you accept the label or not), your sanity and mental health are forever in question, you are considered irrevocably damaged. You now have "problems." Problems that make other people deeply uncomfortable, problems they don't want to have to think about.



Not to mention that the rapist in question in this particular case —Bill Cosby— is a powerful man who has so much money and influence that it's impossible to imagine anyone more influential; for kids who grew up watching the Cosby show (as millions did), Cosby was LITERALLY viewed as a father figure, and the man is so rich that he tried to BUY NBC in the '90s. Please, take a moment to let that sink in.



These are stories women are discouraged from telling. We are not supposed to have "let this happen." We are not supposed to have gone out late at night. We should not have trusted our own judgment, we should not have trusted the men who hurt us, we should have known this would happen. Chances are, you have been taught to believe these things your whole life, and part of you probably still believes them.



And if you have read this far and your takeaway is still that Cosby is "innocent until proven guilty," consider that you are contributing to the problem. Consider that Cosby will likely never see the inside of a courtroom, that in 2006 he settled out of court for an undisclosed amount of money, which was probably received by a woman who was intimidated and threatened by Cosby's lawyers, who would not have been able to afford the kind of legal counsel available to Cosby, who wanted justice as much as you and I do (hell, more), but who realized that our society is deeply fucked up and stacked against women, who wanted her life to return to normalcy as soon as possible, who did not want to have to face Cosby again in a courtroom. To go to court would be to risk losing even more, and she had already lost enough.


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#90
ASounds like his womanizing and sex addiction was fairly non-stop, with a system of enablers on a level only he could afford. Not surprising that the Cos never understood the meaning of "no."

http://m.nydailynews.com/entertainment/g...?cid=bitly
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#91

Every day the list just keeps getting longer and longer. If these allegations are true, the fact that his wife turned a blind eye (she must've known) is pretty horrible as well. I wonder how their four daughters would respond to this.

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#92
A[quote name="User_32" url="/community/t/152192/bill-cosby-comedian-rapist/50#post_3806777"]Every day the list just keeps getting longer and longer. If these allegations are true, the fact that his wife turned a blind eye (she must've known) is pretty horrible as well. I wonder how their four daughters would respond to this. 
[/quote]

Let's not go hunting for other heads just yet. It is perfectly plausible that she's been lied to and kept in the dark. If the Green River Killer can murder nearly a hundred women and get home in time for dinner with his wife and children, a guy with Cosby's resources and public reputation can successfully deceive his family about his indiscretions and / or crimes.
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#93
AOn another topic, has any stand-up outside of Patton Oswalt and Jim Norton said anything about this? Seems that a lot of them are (wisely) waiting to see where the chips fall.
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#94

Whatever turns out to be the absolute truth, Cosby's public perception went from this






to this



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#95
A[quote name="JacknifeJohnny" url="/community/t/152192/bill-cosby-comedian-rapist/90#post_3806880"]On another topic, has any stand-up outside of Patton Oswalt and Jim Norton said anything about this? Seems that a lot of them are (wisely) waiting to see where the chips fall.[/quote]

Late night hosts Conan, Stewart, and Maher all made some jokes. Maher spent some time talking about it with his panel.
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#96
A[quote name="Jmurdoch" url="/community/t/152192/bill-cosby-comedian-rapist/50#post_3806882"]
Late night hosts Conan, Stewart, and Maher all made some jokes. Maher spent some time talking about it with his panel.[/quote]

Those guys I know about and they're sort of expected to say something, thinking more along the lines of guys without talk shows who are still primarily known for stand-up.
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#97
A[quote name="JacknifeJohnny" url="/community/t/152192/bill-cosby-comedian-rapist/90#post_3806887"]
Those guys I know about and they're sort of expected to say something, thinking more along the lines of guys without talk shows who are still primarily known for stand-up.[/quote]

I'd like to hear that also. Norm McDonald, Dave Chappelle, and Marc Maron all must have interesting takes on this.
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#98
A[quote name="Waaaaaaaalt" url="/community/t/152192/bill-cosby-comedian-rapist/50#post_3806623"]Ohh im well aware of that and it's part of the reason I think Al Sharpton might not be the greatest guy in the world. However in her case it was still only 1 person. You give me 14 girls getting together and accussing a guy and then we will talk.
[/quote]


I don't know whether Sharpton simply bet on the wrong horse, or whether he was in on a fraudulent shakedown attempt that went too far and backfired, but without Al Sharpton's efforts, we still wouldn't know if the Brawley accusations were true or not. It took Sharpton's media evangelism to get the case before a grand jury in Ed Koch's New York.

As for Cosby? Maybe his criticism of hip hop culture, which was drawing criticism in Aaron McGruder's Boondocks a decade ago, and which has inspired Hannibal Buress to call Cosby a hypocrite now, was really him making a public spectacle out of his grapples with his own guilt. Maybe he's just an old man who doesn't like what the kids are into now. I don't know the personal struggles of Cosby, of his growing number of accusers, or of the former NBC employee who now says that Cosby gave him cash and told him to pay women off in checks in his own name, in order to provide Cosby with cover. Maybe I don't need to mind meld with all these people to form an opinion, though. Judges aren't telepaths, either.

What tips the scale for me is the way he's being hung out to dry by NBC. False accusations don't turn make a proven commodity like Bill Cosby too radioactive for a network to touch. NBC knew.

_
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#99

http://gawker.com/man-says-he-stood-guar...295090/all



edit: Whoops.  Didn't realize it'd already been posted.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Jmurdoch View Post


I'd like to hear that also. Norm McDonald, Dave Chappelle, and Marc Maron all must have interesting takes on this.

Considering these allegations have been around for over a decade, I assume these guys have at least heard the stories countless times before.

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AAnother aspect of this story, which distinguishes it in my mind from what Bryan Singer recently went through, is that this isn't one accuser with a long track record of claims against successful artists. There's no ambulance chasing attorney, who has made a career out of suing high and hoping for the out of court settlement. This Cosby scandal isn't the obvious shakedown that Bryan was subjected to. It's just one woman after another, saying, "this was my experience with the man." The obvious upside for the accusers simply isn't there.
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A[quote name="JacknifeJohnny" url="/community/t/152192/bill-cosby-comedian-rapist/50#post_3806887"]
Those guys I know about and they're sort of expected to say something, thinking more along the lines of guys without talk shows who are still primarily known for stand-up.[/quote]

Oswalt tweeted: "You were the first reason I wanted to do comedy. I'll always marvel at your genius onstage. But here's where we say goodbye, Bill Cosby."
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny View Post

On another topic, has any stand-up outside of Patton Oswalt and Jim Norton said anything about this? Seems that a lot of them are (wisely) waiting to see where the chips fall.


Warning: this tweet is very Sarah Silverman-esque, aka offensive. I can hear her stoner delivery in my head every time I read it.



https://twitter.com/SarahKSilverman/stat...9052046336



There was some backlash to this joke on Twitter (of course), but I don't think she's belittling the victims. Just Cosby.



Oh, and Faizon Love also went on a pro-Cosby rant that referred to Hannibal Buress as a "house n****". Yeah. This whole thing is so unpleasant.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Inkblades View Post
 

Oh, and Faizon Love also went on a pro-Cosby rant that referred to Hannibal Buress as a "house n****". Yeah. This whole thing is so unpleasant.


Ohhh I knew that would happen.

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AI thought the Silverman joke was pretty funny, actually.
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