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GODZILLA: KING OF THE MONSTERS (2019) Pre-Release Discussion
#36

Surprised there's controversy over Mothra.  After Godzilla, I assumed she was the next most iconic monster in the Toho stable (at least to the general public).  Plus, the fact that she undergoes a metamorphosis means you really get two monsters for the price of one, which would make her skirmishes with Godzilla feel distinct and interesting in terms of visuals and abilities.

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#37

I've always liked Mothra as an ally/foe of Godzilla over the years. One of the few kaiju that can hang with Big G.

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#38
AI liked when Anguirus would team up with Godzilla. He was more like and angry dog than a partner.
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#39

Oh I understand completely. If they bring him back in the Legendary series I hope they give him his rolling attack that he had in FINAL WARS.

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#40
A[quote name="Reasor" url="/community/t/159051/godzilla-king-of-the-monsters-2019-pre-release-discussion#post_4225876"]
I respectfully disagree with this. The spectacle is just the part that translates the most easily.[/quote]

I'd like to hear your opinion on what I'm missing then. Genuinely curious. And I don't even mean spectacle perjoratively, there's nothing wrong with imagination running wild. It's just that beyond the blatant nuclear symbolism in the original Godzilla (still the only one that truly resonates for me), I don't see what's going on in these beneath the surface level. And again, I'm not being snide, it's just not been a sub genre I've delved deep in.
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#41
Quote:

Originally Posted by Belloq87 View Post
 

Surprised there's controversy over Mothra.  After Godzilla, I assumed she was the next most iconic monster in the Toho stable (at least to the general public).  Plus, the fact that she undergoes a metamorphosis means you really get two monsters for the price of one, which would make her skirmishes with Godzilla feel distinct and interesting in terms of visuals and abilities.



Yes, Mothra is pretty popular, just not my cup of tea. I look to be in the minority here.



How about King Ceaser? Was it in Godzilla Final Wars that he teamed up with Anguirus to try and bring down the Big G?



I liked Final Wars only because Godzilla was kicking ass and taking names all day long, but I wish it was better.



Anyone here see the latest Godzilla flick? Is it available to watch online anywhere?

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#42

Mothra's boring.



BOOORRRRRRRIIIINNNNNNNGG.



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#43
Quote:

Originally Posted by Electrichead View Post
 




Anyone here see the latest Godzilla flick? Is it available to watch online anywhere?


Its good, but the movie took the material a tad too seriously for my tastes.

I've got good news and I've got bad news. The bad news is that I have lost my way. The good news is that I'm way ahead of schedule.
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#44
A[quote name="Electrichead" url="/community/t/159051/godzilla-king-of-the-monsters-2019-pre-release-discussion#post_4225955"]Anyone here see the latest Godzilla flick? Is it available to watch online anywhere?[/quote]

I saw it twice during its limited theatrical run here in the States, and it's probably the easiest example of what I'm talking about, since the Abe administration is the stuff of current headlines. The movie is permeated with right wing Japanese politics, from nationalist reevaluation of Japan's relationship with America, to the theme of private contractors getting the job done after government bureaucrats fumble their management of the crisis again and again. It's a really fun movie even on the surface, alternately goofy and horrifying, but it's also very much a snapshot of the national political conversation over there.

Shin Godzilla is slated for release on DVD and Blu-Ray in Japan next month, and given how successful the theatrical run here was, I wouldn't expect any more delays than necessary on an American release later this year.
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#45
Quote:

Originally Posted by Electrichead View Post
 


How about King Ceaser? Was it in Godzilla Final Wars that he teamed up with Anguirus to try and bring down the Big G?



Yes.  Rodan too.  They triple teamed Big G Man, and he still kicked their butts;





King of the Monsters, bitch!



Also, the best scene of the entire franchise;



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#46

Seeing Godzilla put down that two bit imposter never gets old.

I've got good news and I've got bad news. The bad news is that I have lost my way. The good news is that I'm way ahead of schedule.
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#47
A[quote name="Chaz" url="/community/t/159051/godzilla-king-of-the-monsters-2019-pre-release-discussion/30#post_4226267"]Seeing Godzilla put down that two bit imposter never gets old.
[/quote]
Oh my god, I can't believe that's a real thing! I want to own that movie JUST for that scene!
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#48
A[quote name="Fraid uh noman" url="/community/t/159051/godzilla-king-of-the-monsters-2019-pre-release-discussion#post_4226283"]
Oh my god, I can't believe that's a real thing! I want to own that movie JUST for that scene![/quote]

Godzilla: Final Wars should be shown in public schools and on national holidays. It was made to celebrate Godzilla's 50th anniversary, it had the largest budget in the franchise to date, and it's throw-everything-at-the-wall crazy. Netflix has it on disk.
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#49

Final Wars. Ewwww. The Die Another Day of kaiju films. But I guess I'm asking a lot from a kaiju thread where Mothra's being hung out to dry.

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#50
Quote:

Originally Posted by Electrichead View Post
 

Anyone here see the latest Godzilla flick? Is it available to watch online anywhere?



Shin Godzilla was amazing, a great way to take a concept that's been done endless times and make it fresh again. It also derailed a lot of my interest in the Legendary franchise. Bring on the Shin Godzilla 2 pre-release thread!

But, as far as I know, it's not available yet online. Sometime later this year from Funimation is the best guess.

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#51
A[quote name="Doc Phibes" url="/community/t/159051/godzilla-king-of-the-monsters-2019-pre-release-discussion#post_4226296"]Final Wars. Ewwww. The Die Another Day of kaiju films. But I guess I'm asking a lot from a kaiju thread where Mothra's being hung out to dry.
[/quote]

And yet Mothra owns in Godzilla: Final Wars!

Now I have to rewatch my copy, dammit.
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#52
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fraid uh noman View Post


Oh my god, I can't believe that's a real thing! I want to own that movie JUST for that scene!


Never seen Final Wars?  Last I checked it was up on CRACKLE, just make sure to enbale AdBlock.  Crackle's ad editing suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucks.



But the Godzilla vs GINO fight is indicative of the entire movie.  Its, big, fun, and stupid, and I love it.  And that Sum 41 song was not added in the dub, but part of the actual cut.



Check it out!  Go Go Godzilla!  whoo ooh ooh

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#53

I'll defend FINAL WARS to death you lousy so and sos! It's a gloriously over the top remake of DESTROY ALL MONSTERS and it is awesome.



DIE ANOTHER DAY has nothing on it. Ever. Whoever said that is wrong and we're never going to be best friends!

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#54

Final Wars is a movie that quickly hits ludicrous speed and never lets up.  It's fantastic.  Plus it has Don Frye vs. Aliens and gave us this frame.




For a move that celebrates 50 years of a franchise, it hits the mark for me.

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#55

I'm not judging you guys or anything, but I cannot understand the rabid fanbase for kaiju movies. And what I mean by that is the 1960s and on movies that are all about giant monsters fighting that are basically WWE matches in rubber suits.



I liked Godzilla '14 quite a bit, and Cloverfield, and the original Godzilla. Basically I can see the appeal of giant monsters destroying cities, monsters that are treated as forces of nature. But once they start to gain personalities and the camp factor gets upped, my interest drops to near zero.



Which is funny, because I love American camp, but I think most Japanese entertainment is just not for me. It's bizarre and silly in a way that does not click. I've noticed this is consistent for me from kaiju to anime to most of their horror movies I've seen.



This also extends to Power Rangers. Much like I enjoyed Destroy All Monsters and the like when I was a kid but can't stand them now, I do not get the appeal of Power Rangers as a grown man.



On the flip side, something like Pacific Rim dialed down the camp factor and instilled some humanity with the people-controlled robots. But I didn't like that either! But I like the concept, just not the execution!



Point being, and MichaelM and I were talking about this yesterday, can King of the Monsters and by extension the eventual vs. King Kong maintain the desolate and tense tone of Godzilla '14? After all, that movie did have monster fighting, but it was treated more like giant animals or unknowable gods rather than video game avatars. But Skull Island appears to be amping up the adventure, quippy pew pew factor (and I'm excited about that!), so what will happen when the two characters meet and the tooooooonnnnnnnneeeeesssss have to be combined?



I don't know, lost my train of thought somewhere in there. Love kaiju all you want, but for some reason it's one of my geek dealbreakers.

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#56

Maybe put another way: how does the intended shared Monsterverse balance being entertaining while not devolving into unrecoverable silliness?



Obviously we won't know the quality of the finished product for another month, but KONG SKULL ISLAND looks like a lot of fun without being silly. I'm sure having a giant primate, with presumed more intelligence than giant insects or reptiles, might provide some leeway with tone and antics.



In some ways, I feel like this intended franchise faces some of the same problems the Bond series faces: even with much more serious, "adult" takes on the source material, you only have so many stories to tell before entering into camp or silly territory. We saw that with SPECTRE; I don't know how we get to KONG vs GODZILLA without it being really silly.

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#57
A[quote name="Bartleby_Scriven" url="/community/t/159051/godzilla-king-of-the-monsters-2019-pre-release-discussion/50#post_4226452"]I don't know, lost my train of thought somewhere in there. Love kaiju all you want, but for some reason it's one of my geek dealbreakers. [/quote]

Aww, man. Now I'm afraid to ask you what your favorite live adaptation of Spider-Man is.


[SPOILER=Warning: Spoiler!]

This is the only correct answer.




[/SPOILER]


Seriously, though, when I was at the young age that Americans tend to think kaiju movies are made for, they bored me to tears. There was too much plot in between the monster rampages for hyper six-year old me. It's because I can see something in them now, that went over my head as a kid, that I've come to appreciate the genre. The best of the bunch are fine sci-fi cheese, a camembert of cornball hokeyness.

_
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#58
AI respect that! I just don't get it.

But I also don't get Doctor Who, D&D and most Star Trek. So there you go.
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#59

Like anything, some people don't understand other people's enjoyment of a certain genre and that's fine. I've always enjoyed kaiju movies since I first saw one on TV when I was an impressionable youngster.



Now explain to me why some people don't like Bruce Lee movies. That does not compute for me on any level.

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#60
AMy first kaiju movie was Godzilla Returns/1985 when I was a toddler and it was love at first sight. I loved it even more when my parents started getting me a bunch of the older movies from the 60's and 70's on VHS. Son of Godzilla was my shit for while, I wore that tape out. Not until later in life did I realize it was quite shit compared to most of the rest of the series. That damn froggy muppet face Big G had. But I couldn't help but mark out for for giant mantis', spider, and Minya showing up in Final Wars. I think the director had a soft spot for SoG as well.

While I can appreciate the more serious tone of 2014 and Shin Godzilla, the reason I love Final Wars so much is that it harkens back to the cheesier times from my youth. The Heisei and Millennium series were mostly serious with a lot of unintentional silliness. Except for Space Godzilla. That one jumped the shark for the Hesei series, but vs Desotoroyah was a quick coarse correction.
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#61

 While I wish some of the monster fights in Final Wars where longer, I'm still a fan of that movie. Don Frye is awesome in that movie. He clearly can't act for shit, and yet he has tremendous screen presence.

I've got good news and I've got bad news. The bad news is that I have lost my way. The good news is that I'm way ahead of schedule.
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#62
AIf nothing else his macho mustache has a lot of screen presence.
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#63
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reasor View Post


Aww, man. Now I'm afraid to ask you what your favorite live adaptation of Spider-Man is.
 
This is the only correct answer.



Seriously, though, when I was at the young age that Americans tend to think kaiju movies are made for, they bored me to tears. There was too much plot in between the monster rampages for hyper six-year old me. It's because I can see something in them now, that went over my head as a kid, that I've come to appreciate the genre. The best of the bunch are fine sci-fi cheese, a camembert of cornball hokeyness.

_


I'm seeing a lot of, "I liked kaiju when I was a kid, so its fun silliness takes me back to that." But you said this about seeing something in them now, so I'm curious if you can elaborate?



Are there big sci-fi ideas in these movies? Again I'm talking about this Godzilla





Not this Godzilla



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#64

Childhood nostalgia IS key to the American Godzilla fanbase.



As for deeper themes, Ishiro Honda directed movies do tend to have them. The first Godzilla of course was a parable of Nuclear war. King Kong Vs Godzilla was a satire on the rampant consumerism of the late 50's/early 60's.



Most of his later G films are about the dangers posed by a heavily Technological society subsuming and destroying human values. See esp his last film, Terror of MechaGodzilla.

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#65
AThere's a sci-fi cheesiness that hearkens back to the drive-in theater days in a lot of the classic Godzilla movies, even when they're not all clearly made with an audience of kids in mind. Obviously, movies under this brand that were made for children do exist. Godzilla vs the Smog Monster is a good example of the latter category, as is the entire Rebirth of Mothra trilogy.

I'm not comparing any of these pictures to the works of Asimov or Clarke, for Pete's sake, I'm just saying that Gareth Ewards' Godzilla is hardly the oddball of the franchise for its tone or pacing.
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#66
Quote:

Originally Posted by Reasor View Post

Godzilla vs the Smog Monster


That is one fucked-up Kaiju film.



Bartleby, it might be worth your time seeking this one out. Reasor's entirely correct that there's a strong allegorical/subtext-becomes-text element to the film, and it's not your typical silly Godzilla-flies-on-hi-tail-and-does-wrestling-moves flick.



Caveat in that I haven't seen it in decades, and have zero idea what it's like to view as an adult.

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#67

I hate those 'goofy Godzilla' movies, and avoid them like the plague. There's a big accepting the guys in suits with minitures/suspention of belief factor, but the air-boxing or flying stunts were too much. And the big eyed outfits. Dunno, I don't find much value in them now. I saw them when they came out when I was growing up, in the theatre and can't say I specificly chose Godzilla films, mostly it was taking advantage of the parents letting me go to the all-day films, and I guess Godzilla was considered 'safe' for a kid of 8.

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#68
A[quote name="MichaelM" url="/community/t/159051/godzilla-king-of-the-monsters-2019-pre-release-discussion/50#post_4227172"]
Bartleby, it might be worth your time seeking this one out. Reasor's entirely correct that there's a strong allegorical/subtext-becomes-text element to the film, and it's not your typical silly Godzilla-flies-on-hi-tail-and-does-wrestling-moves flick.[/quote]

As grim as it is, I actually think Smog Monster is one of the kiddie pictures, from a period where Toho figured out that they had a young audience and pushed hard to make the most of that.

Godzilla vs Megalon, the picture that's the source of that immortal tail sliding gif, is another one. That picture tried as hard as it could to introduce a tokusatsu hero, in the vein of Ultraman, who Toho could own outright.
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#69

Well, it was worth it just for this alone.



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#70
A[quote name="MichaelM" url="/community/t/159051/godzilla-king-of-the-monsters-2019-pre-release-discussion/50#post_4227172"]
That is one fucked-up Kaiju film.

Bartleby, it might be worth your time seeking this one out. Reasor's entirely correct that there's a strong allegorical/subtext-becomes-text element to the film, and it's not your typical silly Godzilla-flies-on-hi-tail-and-does-wrestling-moves flick.

Caveat in that I haven't seen it in decades, and have zero idea what it's like to view as an adult.
[/quote]

Obviously, because how can you forget that vs the Smog Monster has something even better than Godzilla doing two physics defying dropkicks?

[VIDEO]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvDq2-TakQ8[/VIDEO]
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