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Bitcoin, Litecoin and Other Cryptocurrencies
#1

Despite having been around for a while, cryptocurrencies remain a somewhat controversial investment, and I can totally understand why. They are relatively nascent, mostly unregulated, unpredictable currencies and a large amount of people still believe that it's a bubble ready to burst, propped up by tech-savvy or overly bullish investors. Doesn't help that most investors (myself included) don't even have a clear understanding of what cryptocurrencies even are, they're merely looking to make a quick buck. And yet, despite all that the trend is still going strong. In the 4 years since the last cryptocurrency thread on CHUD (filled almost exclusively with naysayers) bitcoins have almost quadrupled in price. I myself have, using my conservative investments - with money I figured I could afford to lose if worst came to worst - made profits that would be almost impossible to make under other circumstances.



So since I feel like an idiot playing with forces beyond his understanding, I'm interested, have viewpoints here changed? Do you believe cryptocurrencies are a growing or legitimate market?  Are certain sectors looking up? Or do people here still believe it could all come crashing down any day now?

I might have been born yesterday sir, but I stayed up all night!
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#2
AYou're investing money into something you don't understand?

A someone and his something are quickly parted.
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#3
Quote:
Originally Posted by catartik View Post

You're investing money into something you don't understand?

A someone and his something are quickly parted.

Well it's an exaggeration. I do understand it just not all the intricacies. And in general I've been taking advice from friends who've made an absolute killing on it, not just investing into whatever my dumb ass thinks looks good.



But yeah, I'm definitely trying to learn more so as not to make that type of mistake.

I might have been born yesterday sir, but I stayed up all night!
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#4
AIt does indeed keep going up in value.

I think the skepticism is warranted, though. Remember the Mt.Gox mess?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mt._Gox

I haven't read up on the current state of exchanges. Hopefully there are more reputable ones now? Or do casual traders go through brokers and middlemen?

I think coindorks prefer to call it "a commodity, not a currency".
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#5
AI have to admit I expected the bubble to burst long ago. I imagine improvements in processor chips have had a lot to do with the currency's continued validity.

I'd still recommend anyone interested in investing in the currency to be aware that the stuff's increasing value is due to the increasing amount of horsepower needed to perform the calculations. This is a currency that is designed from day one to become more scarce over time. Nobody knows what's going to happen when the algorithm reaches a point where current technology can't mine any more coins.

I'd also bring up Mount Gox if Kyle hadn't. The incident should be a reminder that the FDIC will not cover these funds if they're stolen, as Bitcoin exists to operate outside conventional markets and banks.

Make your money and get out of it, would still be my advice.
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#6
AI mean, as long as you're not mortgaging your house to play around with this, well, if you win some scratch, more power to you. But Reasor has already listed some things that are still items of concern, and I'll just say that I have never, ever seen, heard of, or read about a bubble that didn't eventually burst.
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#7

There are really two things going on here; The Crytocurrencies, and the underlying Blockchain technology.


The later is very real and every major bank is working on it as a way to drastically cut their operating costs. The Venture Capitalists are making bank on it by investing in startups that will get bought up or they'll get their money out otherwise.



I don't see how the existing "wild" currencies like Bitcoin are anything other than an electronic Pyramid Scheme. If you have a dollar bill in your pocket, it's buying power will decline by 1-2% per year baring a major spike in inflation. A bit o Bitcoin can appreciate or depreciate by huge percentages within minutes or seconds. Who wants to use that as a real currency? As a speculation though it rocks.



I also love how proponents go on and on about how "Bitcoin's never been hacked!". Well pretty much everything in the chain other than the Blockchain itself HAS been hacked, so that bragging point is meaningless. It's as if your house gets burgled, your wallet lifted, your local bank vault broken into, but you're all like "But the Armored car's NEVER been robbed!".



The whole premise of Bitcoin is supposed to be that it's a currency out of any government's control. Assuming that's even true (I have doubts) that makes it ideal for criminal conspiracies. So if you want to buy Russian Whores or drugs or a Sonic Bowel Disruptor Cannon  I guess it's fine.

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#8

Here's a neat description of Blockchain in comic format!



http://www.ozy.com/fast-forward/wtf-is-b...rnet/81567

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#9
AYeah, blockchain is magical pixie dust and will utterly transform everything forever, just like the last six thousand Future Of All Computing Forever technologies were...
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#10
Quote:

Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post

Yeah, blockchain is magical pixie dust and will utterly transform everything forever, just like the last six thousand Future Of All Computing Forever technologies were...


Yeah anytime somehow uses the word "disruptive" just substitute the word "bullshit".

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#11
AI'm hot to try the new Crispy Chicken Quesadilla from Taco Bell, though I fear it may be disruptive to my bowel industry.
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#12
A[quote name="Kyle Reese" url="/community/t/159726/bitcoin-litecoin-and-other-cryptocurrencies#post_4387782"]I'm hot to try the new Crispy Chicken Quesadilla from Taco Bell, though I fear it may be disruptive to my bowel industry.[/quote]

It's pretty good. The otherwise terrible chicken chips soften up and become palatable when grilled in the cheese.
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#13

A few months ago I spent basically an entire day hunting through old computers and disconnected hard-drives in drawers.  Pretty sure I have either 10 bitcoins stuck somewhere, or in a landfill at this point.



*sigh*

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#14
Quote:

Originally Posted by Overlord View Post
 

A few months ago I spent basically an entire day hunting through old computers and disconnected hard-drives in drawers.  Pretty sure I have either 10 bitcoins stuck somewhere, or in a landfill at this point.



*sigh*



You may want to to try and find the landfill.  That's like $60k.

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#15
AYou'll have to do battle with the Lawnmower Man in Cyberspace if you want to win back those Dogecoins.
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#16
AShould have invested in Poopcaps on the ground floor.
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#17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cylon Baby View Post
 

The whole premise of Bitcoin is supposed to be that it's a currency out of any government's control. Assuming that's even true (I have doubts) that makes it ideal for criminal conspiracies. So if you want to buy Russian Whores or drugs or a Sonic Bowel Disruptor Cannon  I guess it's fine.



Oh Bitcoin has absolutely been used for nefarious reasons, it largely fuelled the whole Silk Road controversy a few years back. But that was only a tiny percentage of the coin's usage and it's not like regular money hasn't been used in criminal conspiracies.



Quote:

Originally Posted by Reasor View Post

I'd still recommend anyone interested in investing in the currency to be aware that the stuff's increasing value is due to the increasing amount of horsepower needed to perform the calculations. This is a currency that is designed from day one to become more scarce over time. Nobody knows what's going to happen when the algorithm reaches a point where current technology can't mine any more coins.


It's only set to reach the cap by 2040, which still gives it plenty time for evolution but at the moment, as far as I know, it's designed to be like the gold standard. The plan is that once the cap is reached, the bitcoins will be divided into fractions (and technically they already have).

I might have been born yesterday sir, but I stayed up all night!
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#18

Fascinating article regarding Russia's newfound embrace of Bitcoin.



https://news.vice.com/story/russia-is-go...t-a-theory

I might have been born yesterday sir, but I stayed up all night!
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#19
AFresh Air has tech author Nathan Popper on today/tonight talking about the Bitcoin.
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#20

I'm sure they would like to call it 'investing' but it's really just people playing a lottery....they are just trying to get rich quick.



Quote:


The Force Behind Bitcoin’s Meteoric Rise: Millions of Asian Investors


Retail investors, mostly in Asia, are pushing the price of bitcoin to new heights



Behind the stunning rise of bitcoin lies a new force in global financial markets: millions of individual Asian investors.



Despite the attention focused on the launch of bitcoin futures in the U.S. this weekend, the center of gravity for trading the virtual currency, measured by volumes, has been in the East—starting in China, before shifting earlier this year to Japan, and recently to South Korea as the latest hot spot.



And unlike past financial frenzies—such as the dot-com bubble of the late 1990s, when U.S. retail investors only piled in at the later stages of the rally—individual investors have been first to the party, fueling bitcoin’s 1,600% rise this year.


<cont>

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#21

I have a few hundred quids worth of Bitcoin, mostly for shits n giggles than any serious investment. The problem with it all is there is literally nothing underpinning the value of the currency. It's purely speculative. There's a potential market bottom of about $1,500 which I think is the price in electricity required to mine a single coin, but otherwise the coin itself has no value apart from what someone else is prepared to pay for that coin. With most other commodities and currencies you have a transactional value in goods and services which help steel up the value of a currency. Artificial scarcity is not enough to assign a value on it's own.



However, you can say the same about Diamonds and they've managed to hold their value for the last hundred year or so.

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#22
A[quote name="flint" url="/community/t/159726/bitcoin-litecoin-and-other-cryptocurrencies#post_4426165"]However, you can say the same about Diamonds and they've managed to hold their value for the last hundred year or so.[/quote]
Yes, but diamonds are pretty, and the diamonds that aren't pretty have objectively useful applications.
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#23
Quote:

Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post


Yes, but diamonds are pretty, and the diamonds that aren't pretty have objectively useful applications.


They are also tangible assets, not ephemeral illusions of some sort of data coin.



Do I regret not getting into this whole thing when the coins were cheap? Hell yes.  At the same time, these things feel to be complete illusions that are going to blow up in everyone's faces one of these days.

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#24
Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post


Yes, but diamonds are pretty, and the diamonds that aren't pretty have objectively useful applications.


The value of diamonds is pretty much due solely to market manipulation in addition to being a relatively easy way to launder $$ in an untraceable way.



Quote:

Have You Ever Tried to Sell a Diamond?


An unruly market may undo the work of a giant cartel and of an inspired, decades-long ad campaign


Quote:


The mined-diamond industry is mightily concerned that the rapidly growing man-made diamond industry is on a course to disrupt their business. At least that is the conclusion I draw from the Diamond Producers Association’s new marketing campaign “Real Is Rare.”  The DPA was organized in May 2015 by seven of the world’s leading diamond companies. Its new marketing efforts are backed up by a study conducted by KRC Research entitled What Women Really Want among 1,000 millennial-aged women (18-35 years).


<cont>

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#25
Quote:

Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post


Yes, but diamonds are pretty, and the diamonds that aren't pretty have objectively useful applications.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Judas Booth View Post
 


They are also tangible assets, not ephemeral illusions of some sort of data coin.




But, importantly, they are objectively worthless. Not just 'theoretically'. Gold has scarcity and is pretty. You buy a lump of gold from a store and you can sell it back to that store at a market value. Try buying a diamond and selling it back to a store. You'll get nothing for it (super high grade ones aside). Diamonds are plentiful and the value attributed to them for the average joe in the street is artificially controlled through gatekeepers.

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#26

To the surprise of no one...?


Quote:

Bitcoin volatility sees trades suspended on certain exchanges



Bitcoin plunged on Friday, extending a fall that saw the crypto-currency lose more than a third of its value from a record of nearly $20,000 (£15,000).


The crypto-currency's price dipped below $11,000 on Friday, according to the Coindesk exchange website, before recovering to about $12,000.



Amid the swing, three Bitcoin-related exchanges suspended certain trades.



Bitcoin has had a blistering trip over the past 12 months. Its price at the start of the year was $1,000.



It is now on track for its worst week since 2013.


<cont>

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#27
AEnjoy your giant pile of tulip bulbs, guys!
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#28

Yeah, interesting to see what'll happen here. I actually cashed out a lot of my bitcoin, since this particular crash has been predicted by investors for a while now but I'll probably buy back in once it's reaches a certain low.

I might have been born yesterday sir, but I stayed up all night!
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#29
AAnd in other news, a bunch of cryptocurrency investors are planning to move to Puerto Rico to avoid paying taxes on their bottlecaps. I'm sure the Atlas Shrugged fantasy is even more of a good idea when the Masters of Industry building it are basing their entire scheme on imaginary tulip bulbs.
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