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IT (Chapter Two: The Ritual of Chüd) Pre-Release Discussion
#36
I feel like we spent a not insignifigant portion of the last IT thread talking about King and fat people.
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#37
We can always talk about whether or not Holdo should have told Poe her plan instead.
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#38
Franny's dad basically farts after death in THE STAND. And he wasn't even fat!
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#39
Having just re-read IT, I can confirm that during an extended sequence focused on Patrick Hockstetter, he flashes back to murdering his baby brother and the kid farts while dying.

Ugh, reading that part as a dad now was rough.
"I'd rather have hope...than nothing at all."
-Illyana Rasputin, X-Men: Omega #1

"But the public, knowing what it wanted, spinning happily, let the comic books survive."
-Ray Bradbury, Fahrenheit 451

Twitter: @BartLBishop
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#40
Idris Elba for the Fart.
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#41
If I recall right, Dreamcatcher is all about the horror of farting. What if you couldn’t stop farting?!?
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#42
Okay, but what if...and just hear me out on this...what if the reason Holdo didn't tell Poe is because she overheard Poe fat-shaming Rose?

wowe makes u think
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#43
No STAR WARS talk in the IT thread!
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#44
Agreed. No Star Wars ever.

Moving on, I'm actually really curious if this movie can communicate something about Generation X. The book, and to a lesser extent the 1990 mini-series, isn't just about how adults lose the ability to use their imaginations the way they did as children (and also that bit from The Body/Stand By Me how you never have friends like the friends you had at 12), but is specifically about how Baby Boomers sold out. It's basically The Big Chill, but more cynical and supernatural. King, for instance, in the book makes it a point to have Richie be an ex hippie.

So what do you use these kids to say about being teens in the '90s, graduating from college in 1998, experiencing 9/11 in their 20s, and so on?
"I'd rather have hope...than nothing at all."
-Illyana Rasputin, X-Men: Omega #1

"But the public, knowing what it wanted, spinning happily, let the comic books survive."
-Ray Bradbury, Fahrenheit 451

Twitter: @BartLBishop
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#45
Have them grow up to be Republicans?
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#46
I still think Jensen Ackles should be Ben. He is the right age and a good looking dude. He has the blue collar vibe that Ben has even though he makes six figures. Finally I think the dude deserves to play something other than Dean Winchester.
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#47
(04-13-2018, 03:05 PM)shaunh Wrote: Have them grow up to be Republicans?

Sure. That's basically what happens in the book with them all as yuppies. 

Bill is specifically framed as not being an intellectual, with a whole flashback to him in college butting heads with his professor over "low brow" science fiction and horror stories and Bill arguing that stories only need to entertain and don't need to be political or say anything about the human condition. So Stephen King on his soapbox. Even though he's a staunch liberal, he's always had this tension with intellectualism. 

Only Bev in the fashion industry borders on being a high society elitist, but King saves that for Bev's radical feminist friend who crumbles and spills the beans to Bev's crazy husband Tom when Tom threatens to cut up her face.
"I'd rather have hope...than nothing at all."
-Illyana Rasputin, X-Men: Omega #1

"But the public, knowing what it wanted, spinning happily, let the comic books survive."
-Ray Bradbury, Fahrenheit 451

Twitter: @BartLBishop
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#48
Speaking of Bev's husband, my guess is that he is the one who fills Bowers role, since Mike killed Henry in Chapter 1.
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#49
Tom basically gets possessed by Henry toward the end of the book, so that definitely works.
"I'd rather have hope...than nothing at all."
-Illyana Rasputin, X-Men: Omega #1

"But the public, knowing what it wanted, spinning happily, let the comic books survive."
-Ray Bradbury, Fahrenheit 451

Twitter: @BartLBishop
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#50
I think if you're going to go the "how Gen X sold out," folks like Peter Thiel and Paul Ryan are good models.
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#51
I really wonder how Richie will be handled. He's basically a proto-Howard Stern in the book, one nudge away from being a shock jock, but today shock jocks are also DEEP STATE wackjobs.
"I'd rather have hope...than nothing at all."
-Illyana Rasputin, X-Men: Omega #1

"But the public, knowing what it wanted, spinning happily, let the comic books survive."
-Ray Bradbury, Fahrenheit 451

Twitter: @BartLBishop
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#52
(04-13-2018, 02:59 PM)bartleby_scriven Wrote: So what do you use these kids to say about being teens in the '90s, graduating from college in 1998, experiencing 9/11 in their 20s, and so on?

I will be very surprised if this is explored in any explicit way in the movie. It may be there under the surface in some fashion, but without the luxury of 100s of pages and digressions, I don't know how the movie gets at this in a direct way.
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#53
Richie would have a podcast.

No, but for real, I think you could maybe make him a stand-up, or a performer on a sketch show.
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#54
(04-13-2018, 03:26 PM)Belloq87 Wrote:
(04-13-2018, 02:59 PM)bartleby_scriven Wrote: So what do you use these kids to say about being teens in the '90s, graduating from college in 1998, experiencing 9/11 in their 20s, and so on?

I will be very surprised if this is explored in any explicit way in the movie.  It may be there under the surface in some fashion, but without the luxury of 100s of pages and digressions, I don't know how the movie gets at this in a direct way.

The benefit of the book and the mini-series was how potent the idea of 1950s suburbia had already become by 1985. American Graffiti, Grease and Happy Days really codified the myth of that era, so it was an easy shorthand to contrast against.

But what's 1989 represent for today in easy shorthand? Mostly just pop music, mullets and Spielberg movies. Although kudos to IT Chapter One for incorporating the missing children's posters so prominently into the plot. That felt more authentically of the time than NKOTB needle drops.
"I'd rather have hope...than nothing at all."
-Illyana Rasputin, X-Men: Omega #1

"But the public, knowing what it wanted, spinning happily, let the comic books survive."
-Ray Bradbury, Fahrenheit 451

Twitter: @BartLBishop
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#55
What's Mike going to do? Just own his dad's farm?
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#56
(04-13-2018, 03:27 PM)boone daniels Wrote: Richie would have a podcast.

No, but for real, I think you could maybe make him a stand-up, or a performer on a sketch show.

Stand-up is huge right now, so that'd work great. Nice idea.
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#57
I could see Ritchie having been a stand-up or sketch comic when he was young, and a brilliant one, but by middle age he'd be the unfunny host of an unfunny podcast or cable show.  He's Dennis Miller or Bill Maher.
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#58
Hader doing his best Marc Maron would work for me. Maybe when we first meet him, he’s recording a self-obsessed intro to his interview with Dave Franco, something like that.
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#59
(04-13-2018, 03:27 PM)boone daniels Wrote: Richie would have a podcast.

No, but for real, I think you could maybe make him a stand-up, or a performer on a sketch show.

As long as the stand up is better than it was in the original film.
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#60
(04-13-2018, 03:33 PM)Munson Wrote: What's Mike going to do? Just own his dad's farm?

Libraries are actually still very much a big deal in small towns and communities like Derry, so if you throw in a line about how state budget cuts are causing cuts to library services - maybe if you want to get all political, tie that directly into the fact that It has returned, i.e., cutbacks to after school programs mean more kids are on the streets - you don't really need to change much about Mike. You don't even need all that political shit I just said.

(04-13-2018, 04:53 PM)arjen rudd Wrote: Hader doing his best Marc Maron would work for me. Maybe when we first meet him, he’s recording a self-obsessed intro to his interview with Dave Franco, something like that.

"Are we doin' this? Pow! Lock the gates! Chattin' With Rich is brought to you by Adam and Eve dot com. My guest today is Dave Franco, but first, I'm havin' some issues. Havin' some real issues. Thinking, am I a good person? Did I make the right choices? Have I alienated people? You know, they say you never have better friends then when you're eleven or twelve, and the older I get, the more I think that's true. But, you know, you say things, people move away, you don't see them in years. I get it. Life happens. I'm human. I'm a person. I have wants and needs beyond my own success. But still. It makes you wonder. Makes me wonder. And I'm puttin' the work in on myself, but still, I see a book by my buddy Billy Denborough, and I say "Hey, I should call that guy." And then I think "Nah, he doesn't want to talk to me. He's a success. He has a Pulitzer. I'm just a schmuck with a drug addiction and two ex-wives." And I know. I hear you sayin' it. I have value. I'm a person."
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#61
But Ben stole Mike's role. I mean he could just blatantly be like, hey I'm a librarian now, but it would be bizarre since Ben was the one doing all the research and historical digging. Maybe Ben stays and Mike is a successful... factory farmer? Cattle rancher? But then by IT logic Ben would stay fat, which is fine. It doesn't really matter. I would be cool with them changing a lot of the adult stuff from the book.
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#62
Now that would be interesting.

But Muschietti has already spoken about Mike’s role in this, and while it is pretty different, it’s not that different.
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#63
I do like the drug pushing for Mike. Be wonderful if they relate that all to the Ritual of CHUD, like while the group as been away from Derry, he's been psychotrippin his way into other dimensions and shit.
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#64
Make Mike a teacher
Quick change but still keeps the same aspects about him from the book.

Dynamic between him as a kid being home schooled and raised on a farm, to how he is now apart of the school he didn't get to be apart of as a child. Or just have it when we get flashbacks, after Chapter 1, Mike enrolls at the school and develops an attachment to it.

I'm more interested in what became of Bowers.
That was a nasty fall. I'm guessing he is found but his body is broken. Wheelchair bound the rest of his life with brain damage. They charge him with his dad's murder and all the kids. He'll be in a mental asylum, on a peas and carrots diet. When Pennywise comes back, he gives Bowers the ability to walk and take revenge against the kids who did that to him.
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#65
good ideas, nickp. Maybe he's a social studies teacher.
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#66
Or a history teacher and he is constantly fighting with the school board about teaching Derry's dark past.
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#67
I think it would work with him seeing one of his students disappear.  Or even bring in the opening act of violence from the book. Maybe on of his students, a gay male, is beaten up and left for dead, only to be killed by pennywise.  Mike is questioned by the police on his knowledge of the students involved and that's when it all comes back to him  

Bullies = Henry Bowers 
Initial act of violence = Georgie 
Cops joking about the students blaming a clown = Pennywise 

He makes his phone calls and we get flashbacks from each characters perspective. What happened to them after Chapter 1.  How Mike stayed back, and how becoming a teacher was his way to keep check on the town and possible protect the kids in case IT came back
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#68
I am really interested to see if the opening with the gay couple is included. Considering Henry never drops any n-bombs in Chapter One, when he does about 50,000 times in the book, makes me think the filmmakers will shy away, though.
"I'd rather have hope...than nothing at all."
-Illyana Rasputin, X-Men: Omega #1

"But the public, knowing what it wanted, spinning happily, let the comic books survive."
-Ray Bradbury, Fahrenheit 451

Twitter: @BartLBishop
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#69
I don't see why adult Richie's career has to be changed. Terrestrial radio is still a thing. I never saw Richie as a shock jock; I saw him as funny impressionist who worked blue. That can still work in 2019.
I've got good news and I've got bad news. The bad news is that I have lost my way. The good news is that I'm way ahead of schedule.
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#70
I would think the Stan episode would have to be the opening sequence, no?  The vignette with the gay couple could be alluded to in some way (a montage of dark incidents over the years in Derry, perhaps), but I don't think you open the movie with it.

In other news, Grace's continued distaste for Jessica Chastain is endlessly amusing to me...


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