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THE DRAGON PRINCE
#1
https://ca.ign.com/articles/2018/09/15/n...n-1-review

This is out today!  Omg omg omg!
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#2
(09-15-2018, 07:55 PM)freeman Wrote: https://ca.ign.com/articles/2018/09/15/n...n-1-review

This is out today!  Omg omg omg!

Yeah, this series is what actually prompted me to resurrect the Avatar/Korra thread. I haven't actually watched it yet cause I want to get the kids enthused about it first. We only just finished Trollhunters last night, and I'm hoping we can start on this next.
PSN: Kriegaffe
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#3
Oooh, my kids loved Troll Hunters. I thought it was pretty good too. I still can’t believe the multi-eye dude wasn’t Kelsey Grammar.
If you're happy, you're not paying attention.

Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny: 
Glad that you guys worked that out amongst yourselves.

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#4
(09-16-2018, 01:57 AM)Neil Spurn Wrote: I still can’t believe the multi-eye dude wasn’t Kelsey Grammar.

But... it was Kelsey Grammar. (And his brother was Mark Hamill)
PSN: Kriegaffe
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#5
*sees thread title. is intrigued*

*watches trailer*

HERKY JERKY ANIMATION

*loses interest*
"Nooj's true feelings on any given subject are unknown and unknowable. He is the butterfly flapping its wings in Peking. He is chaos and destruction and you shall never see his true form." - Merriweather

My Steam ID: yizashigreyspear
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#6
Oooh never heard of this but I'm jazzed now. Airbender is one of my favourite animated series ever. I hope this show isn't afraid to get as adult with its themes.
I might have been born yesterday sir, but I stayed up all night!
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#7
(09-16-2018, 10:12 AM)MichaelM Wrote: *sees thread title. is intrigued*

*watches trailer*

HERKY JERKY ANIMATION

*loses interest*

Define “herky jerky.”
“I feel a connection with you. A man connection. A mannection.”
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#8
(09-16-2018, 01:11 PM)lightning slim Wrote:
(09-16-2018, 10:12 AM)MichaelM Wrote: *sees thread title. is intrigued*

*watches trailer*

HERKY JERKY ANIMATION

*loses interest*

Define “herky jerky.”

see for yourself!





it looks like they went for CG animation, toon-shaded it, and then took away CG's fluidity by making it look like it was animated on 3's (or less!) with absolutely no motion blur for the characters

if you don't know what "animating on 3's" means, here's a quick explanation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWEtCsi3Eo8


also, some youtube guy discussing the look of the animation as a conscious aesthetic choice:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7T9Xcw92KOs


I think what makes the choppier animation look even odder is that the camera moves seem to move more smoothly while also having motion blur
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#9
Yeah, all of that seems like a conscious choice to me and doesn’t bother me in the slightest. I don’t want to start another thread about what makes MM tick but his standards are absolutely baffling.
“I feel a connection with you. A man connection. A mannection.”
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#10
I can understand that aesthetic choice bothering people

based on there being a video talking about it, it seems like it isn't just michael taking issue with it
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#11
Don’t equvocate! Michael’s weird! The End!
“I feel a connection with you. A man connection. A mannection.”
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#12
michael likes what he likes!!!

GRIMIOUS & GRITERAL!!
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#13
Going to steal that phrase 'cause I actually like it.

(09-16-2018, 03:32 PM)lightning slim Wrote: I don’t want to start another thread about what makes MM tick but his standards are absolutely baffling.

I'm not sure what's so baffling about having a strong preference for smooth animation.
"Nooj's true feelings on any given subject are unknown and unknowable. He is the butterfly flapping its wings in Peking. He is chaos and destruction and you shall never see his true form." - Merriweather

My Steam ID: yizashigreyspear
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#14
michael loves rotoscoped animation and always has SMOOTH-MOTION turned on for his TV

[Image: AhWr.gif]
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#15
Jesus fuck NO

Rotoscoped animation is hellish. Like something from Dante's inferno.

Motion smoothing is from Satan.

Also, your "animating on 3's" link just leads to the trailer again.
"Nooj's true feelings on any given subject are unknown and unknowable. He is the butterfly flapping its wings in Peking. He is chaos and destruction and you shall never see his true form." - Merriweather

My Steam ID: yizashigreyspear
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#16
you prefer smooth animation!

I'm just trying to help you!

I'm just trying to help!!!!
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#17
It's appreciated. And yes, I very much prefer smooth animation.

From the comments on your second YT link:


Quote:i dont really care about intentions of animators. thing is, this style just makes me dizzy and uncomfortable. i wont be able to watch it, no matter how good the story might be. it just looks... wrong and in uncanny valley side -  i find it creepy and unappealing

Pretty much this. Animating on the 3s is visually jarring for me and doesn't just take me out of the story, it's just plain hard for me to watch.

And yes, I've "tried getting used to it." Nope. It's essentially visual stuttering for me.
"Nooj's true feelings on any given subject are unknown and unknowable. He is the butterfly flapping its wings in Peking. He is chaos and destruction and you shall never see his true form." - Merriweather

My Steam ID: yizashigreyspear
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#18
perhaps you are one of those people on the spectrum sitting just below the people who bigged up SMOOTH MOTION by complaining about the stuttering quality of 24fps!
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#19
I thought it was 48 fps with TEH HOBBLIT?
"Nooj's true feelings on any given subject are unknown and unknowable. He is the butterfly flapping its wings in Peking. He is chaos and destruction and you shall never see his true form." - Merriweather

My Steam ID: yizashigreyspear
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#20
oh that too
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#21
(09-16-2018, 01:25 PM)Nooj Wrote:
(09-16-2018, 01:11 PM)lightning slim Wrote:
(09-16-2018, 10:12 AM)MichaelM Wrote: *sees thread title. is intrigued*

*watches trailer*

HERKY JERKY ANIMATION

*loses interest*

Define “herky jerky.”

see for yourself!





it looks like they went for CG animation, toon-shaded it, and then took away CG's fluidity by making it look like it was animated on 3's (or less!) with absolutely no motion blur for the characters

if you don't know what "animating on 3's" means, here's a quick explanation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWEtCsi3Eo8


also, some youtube guy discussing the look of the animation as a conscious aesthetic choice:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7T9Xcw92KOs


I think what makes the choppier animation look even odder is that the camera moves seem to move more smoothly while also having motion blur

So I'm watching the first episode now.  Will probably keep watching but it's interesting that that second vid mentions the deliberate nature of the visuals. I didn't watch all of it, but the thing I thought of was Spider-Man: Into the Spider-verse, which has that same 3d/stop-motion look that Dragon Prince is kind of going for. Though that's not that fair of a comparison because Spider-man is a full-length feature with a huge budget behind it. So it's able to look as good as it does.

I do like how The Dragon Prince looks, but it absolutely reminds me of what happens when a video game is pushing its engine to the limits. Since there are moments where DP is kind of smooth, and then you have the jerkyness--sometimes all in the same frame.  It's clear there's a lot of detail and ambition going into this thing, but I get the impression that this show is pushing the limits of its budget fucking hard.

Maybe a 2nd season will net these guys more money.
 I think all Marvel films are okay. This is my design.

Except for Thor 2: the literal worst.
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#22
while I don't mind 'choppier' animation as an aesthetic, I totally understand not digging it based on what I've seen of DRAGON PRINCE in the trailer

the thing that CG/toon-shaded animation trying to achieve the feeling of anime ends up bumping up against is the fact that these CG models (as far as I know), can't be deformed to SQUASH & STRETCH the way a 2D artist would be able to do with hand-drawn animation. Whatever limitations of animating on 2's and 3's can have those gaps filled in with creative exaggeration of the character models to still feel like the motion in smooth

from what tiny bit I've seen of DRAGON PRINCE (and other CG anime that tries to look hand-drawn) is that these productions don't put in that additional ability for these models to be able to deform to mimic that kind of exaggeration, so they end up coming across REALLY robotic and stiff compared to the kind of hand-drawn animation they're trying to mimic

BUT, I could be wrong. Maybe the show is saving touches like that for key moments?
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#23
Watched the first 3 eps. The fps seems to vary from shot to shot but that didn't bother me. The cell-shading on the other hand is a bit distracting. Took about an episode to get used to it. I'm interested to see where this is going, but I'm definitely not hooked the way I was at the start of Airbender and Korra. None of the characters have stood out yet and the episodes feel SUPER short. I'm a third way through the season and almost nothing has happened. Also doesn't help that the action scenes are mostly swordfights, which can't really compare to the cool as shit bending fights of Ehasz's other shows.
I might have been born yesterday sir, but I stayed up all night!
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#24
having the show play in front of me right now, I'm gonna side with Michael here (at least in regards to what I'm seeing of this specific show)

I don't mind choppy motion, but I don't think it works in this case.  It really makes everything feel robotic and cheap, intentional or not

and since it doesn't keep that choice consistent in terms of the animation of the camera work and particle/fluid fx, the stuttering robotic quality stands out even more


also... unrelated to the animation rate... but with TV-budgeted toon-shaded CG, how can they ever achieve THESE FACES???

[Image: e87160b90bfc4cbd028fcc902c0dc5ca.jpg]


THE PERSONALITY IN THE ANIMATION IS GONE!!!!!   THEY'RE JUST LITERALLY POSE-ABLE ACTION FIGURES!!!
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#25
I am curious to see how much Avatar and Korra (especially Korra) cost Nickelodeon to make.
 I think all Marvel films are okay. This is my design.

Except for Thor 2: the literal worst.
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#26
Shame on me for thinking the conversation would be about story and character and not animation style. I should know better!
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#27
well, I'm sure that'll happen once people have an opportunity to watch the show

it only just came out!
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#28
A likely story!
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#29
unless I hear some really strong word about this series, I don't think I'll watch it just yet
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#30
I really liked this, but man 9 episodes is not enough. I want more asap.
Quote:"I declare this chestburster an OUTLAAAAAAWW!"
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#31
(09-16-2018, 07:47 PM)freeman Wrote: Shame on me for thinking the conversation would be about story and character and not animation style.  I should know better!

That's sort of like shaming people for talking about the lensing of a live action film. Given it's literally how we see the story, it's absolutely fair game in terms of enjoyment and quality and analysis.
"Nooj's true feelings on any given subject are unknown and unknowable. He is the butterfly flapping its wings in Peking. He is chaos and destruction and you shall never see his true form." - Merriweather

My Steam ID: yizashigreyspear
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#32
I was just joking about the fact that animation discussion tends to devolve into discussion of the literal animation more than for example, live action.

Obviously with such severe stylistic differences it's only natural. Doesn't mean I can't joke about it though.

You fuck.
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#33
Don't call me names.


Unless you really mean it.
"Nooj's true feelings on any given subject are unknown and unknowable. He is the butterfly flapping its wings in Peking. He is chaos and destruction and you shall never see his true form." - Merriweather

My Steam ID: yizashigreyspear
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#34
Finished this up earlier today. It ends very nicely and I did warm to a few of the characters (while still wishing they had the expressiveness of hand-drawn animation) but there isn't enough of it which makes the season feel quite slight. The whole thing feels almost like a prologue to whatever the actual story will end up being.
I might have been born yesterday sir, but I stayed up all night!
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#35
I liked the plot of the first episode. I feel like I was really willing to give the animation a chance, but it ended distracting me. My theory was that with hand drawn animation, animators can emphasise the movement of a character on the frames. So the jump from one frame to the next feels fine, because the two images are designed around helping the brain figure out what happened.

This felt like the frames we were seeing were just taken arbitrarily. So it was neither realistic, nor stylised to take advantage of selecting specific images for each frame. I might be wrong about this, but it sure looked weird.

Other than that, I liked the plot, so I'll keep watching.
PSN: Kriegaffe
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