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Afternoon, everybody: The Cheers/Frasier Appreciation Thread.
#1
Cheers. The greatest sitcom of the 80's right? The reason that I'm tempted to order a Screaming Viking in bars sometimes. I started coming of age during the Rebecca years, so I'm a bigger fan of the show's second half, although there's gold throughout the Diane years too.

Frasier I stuck with for the first few season but then kind of fell off. I didn't like hanging out with that crew as much as the original gang.

Judas just posted the clip of Frasier and Lilith on TV, so here's my favorite moment of one of the characters appearing on TV:



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#2
Reposting here as it's probably the single best moment in the entire show for Frazier.



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#3
Cheers just had it down. You wanted to engage in a prank war with Gary's Old Towne Tavern. You wanted to walk around in squeaky shoes. You wanted to be at that bar. It was all so real.

Frasier was alright I suppose.
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#4
Funniest line in the entire run of the show: "You'll be all right, Margaret. Women have that extra layer of fat."

Years later I would be stunned to realize a couple of seasons in that the inmate who didn't say anything on Orange is the New Black was Margaret.
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#5
I personally feel that the show never really recovered from losing Shelly Long. Sam and Diane and their dynamic...they tried to replace them and Kirstie Alley was very good, but the dynamic wasn't as strong.
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#6
I disagree there. The first 3 or 4 years with Rebecca are probably my favorites. Kelsey Grammer really started to come into his own during that period. Plus the rivalry that developed between Sam and Robin Colcord made for some awesome episodes. There is no doubt that the Sam/Diane dynamic was crucial to establishing the series but Long leaving seemed to give the rest of the ensemble more to do.
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#7
I remember reading an interview with one of the producers that Long leaving kind of saved the show, because it would have become a show about marriage instead of a show about a bar.

Rebecca was always more appealing to me as a character. Her tough exterior barely masking her complete insecurity was relatable, while Long/ Diane always seemed designed to keep you at arm's length.
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#8
[Image: n0TRun.gif]
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#9
I've rewatched the entire run more than once. It started funny, and it stayed funny.

Those early seasons are a bit more dramatic at times, but excellent (I soooo wish Coach had lived longer), but I agree that once Long left, the show shifted into a different-but-still-good mode.

I watched Frasier when it was on, but I haven't really wanted to revisit it. It was witty.
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#10
I prefer Cheers because it feels like a weekly stage farce, knocking the crane brothers’ infinite pomposity down lower and lower

I think that just tends to be a preference in tone for me

I enjoyed all of Cheers when I watched through it long ago, but I never felt like revisiting it, whereas I’ve revisited frajer a ton
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#11
(10-01-2019, 03:28 PM)Nooj Wrote: I prefer Frasier because it feels like a weekly stage farce, knocking the crane brothers’ infinite pomposity down lower and lower

I think that just tends to be a preference in tone for me

I enjoyed all of Cheers when I watched through it long ago, but I never felt like revisiting it, whereas I’ve revisited frajer a ton

I assume you meant Frasier in that first spot, because I completely agree.  That stagey feeling just felt so perfect for those characters (except for Mad Dog, may that character burn in hell).

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#12
whoops! yup!

dunno how I missed that!

yeah mad dog wasn’t so great when the show started expanding him later on
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#13
(Borat voice) My wife works well when she has some kind of television show on in the background, which allows her to watch TV shows at a remarkable clip.

While studying for her first semester exams in law school in her 1L year, she watched every season of Frasier in I think about six weeks. I'd go to sleep, she'd be watching Frasier. I'd wake up, she'd be watching Frasier. I started to dream about those tossed salads and scrambled eggs. (Though for a long time, I thought that last line was "Let's call it a ham" for some reason.)

I have not watched Frasier since. But I've been tempted to dip back into CHEERS.
home taping is killing music
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#14
Like several here, I started liking Cheers more in the later seasons (the Rebecca + Robin Colcord years in particular -- R.I.P., Roger Rees), though I'm stan for Frasier, if I have to be absolutely straight-up, here. That show featured a great deal more intellectually-driven humor than Cheers did, plus the interplay between the siblings and their father was the driving heartbeat of the series.

Which is not to knock Cheers at all, it's still an amazing achievement, but season-for-season I think Frasier has the slightly better and consistent batting-average.
"These guys are pros, Michael. They're gonna push the tension 'till the last possible moment before they strip."

 
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#15
John Mahoney was great on Frasier. Most of the laughs I got from the show were due to him. There was nothing bad about the show but after a couple of years I just drifted from it.

I don't want to rag on Diane. Long was wonderful in the early years. I think of the episode where the gang switches out a cruel rejection letter she received from a submission tape she sent to be a ballet dancer. Lot of funny moments in that one but it ends on a rather somber scene where Diane realizes her dream of dancing is dead. Long played that bit perfectly.
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#16
I loved Cheers and never could get on the wavelength of Frasier, although my missus has watched every ep at least twice. I preferred Kelsey Grammer's energy as a supporting character.

I'm also Team Rebecca/Woody Years if anything, but I don't really care to pick and choose too much, I love pretty much all of it.
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#17
I loved Cheers when it was launched, with reservations. At the time of its premiere I recall it was basically dropped into a supposed 'death slot' where a bunch of other previous NBC comedies went to die slow seasonal deaths (Dabney Coleman in "Buffalo Bill" - also with Geena Davis - being one, I believe). At the time, there were only three networks and I really didn't want to get attached to a show that could get tossed into the reject bin, yet again. I think the ratings for most of Season 1 amounted to a couple of crickets (and me). But, like Hill Street Blues, it won a bunch of Emmys, which brought it some viewer attention, and to my surprise Cheers was renewed for a second season. The rest is history, along with legacy of catchphrases. There's a guy at work whose name is Norm. Guess what the typical greeting is when he walks into the office?
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#18
Here's a great piece from last year focusing on Cheers' writers:

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-f...om-1113428

Love that this bit is cited as a favorite:

Quote:In "From Beer to Eternity" the Cheers bar takes on Gary's Old Time Tavern in a bowl-off. It has one of my favorite Norm exits. He tells Cliff he's going to get a beer in the bowling alley's bar. You see him go through a door and you hear "Norm!" Sam says to Cliff, "How the hell do they know him here?" And Cliff says, "He's got a life, you know."
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#19
I liked them both. Cheers more though. Actually visiting the Bull and Finch Pub and standing under THAT sign was one of the coolest things ever. I watched Cheers ever since '91-'92 or so (yes, when I was 10 years old....I was a weird kid. Probably weirder adult). It and MASH used to come on every night after the news at 10:30..
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#20
Also, it was awesome stumbling across the Cheers bar near Boston Common in Fallout 4 (called “Prost” — you can do the German translation yourself), replete with tons of dead corpses inside.
"These guys are pros, Michael. They're gonna push the tension 'till the last possible moment before they strip."

 
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#21




This kills me every time.

I like Fraiser but prefer Cheers by a wide margin. I like the Diane/Coach years but prefer the Rebecca/Woody years. 

I would go as far to say Cheers, for me, is second only to Seinfeld in the pantheon of all time sitcoms.
"Every romantic comedy should just be called "Tryin' to Fuck" - Patton Oswalt
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#22
My favorite moment in Cheers EVER was when everyone was taping something. I think it was a goodbye video but I can't remember who for. Or maybe just a congrats video. Anyways...when it showed Frasier's, there is a window behind him and you can see a suicide jumper fly past. That might be the funniest thing I'd seen in a comedy show until Arrested Development..
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#23
(10-01-2019, 07:55 PM)fraid uh noman Wrote: I liked them both. Cheers more though. Actually visiting the Bull and Finch Pub and standing under THAT sign was one of the coolest things ever. I watched Cheers ever since '91-'92 or so (yes, when I was 10 years old....I was a weird kid. Probably weirder adult). It and MASH used to come on every night after the news at 10:30..

I didn't start watching it till it was in reruns in the late 80s. NZ only had 2 channels and there was a half-hour sitcom every weekday on one of them before the 6:30 news. 

I remember Different Strokes finishing its run and Cheers moving into that slot and me and my Different Strokes-loving brothers being all, "Awwwwww, maaaannnnn," and our old man being all, "Don't sweat it lads, you're going to love THIS show even more."

And he was right.
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#24
I recently rewatched Cheers all the way thru on Netflix and while its lost some of its magic for me (mainly cause I've seen it so many times) it still holds up as my favorite show of all time. I know some have said that Frazier has more intellectual humor but Cheers was a damn smart show too in its own right. So many words and phrases I use, still to this day, come from Cheers. Even if I dont know what the hell half of them mean, I do get the context right. Thanks Cheers.
I liked the Diane years a little better but it's true, once Rebecca came in the rest of the cast had alot more to do. After watching it again I forgot how much of a scamp Sam truly was, a lovable one but still a scamp. Half the episodes was Sam trying to get Rebecca to have sex with him any way possible. Immature but damn funny.
And I'll say it the best final episode of a series of all time. Everyone should stop what they're doing and watch again. Just perfect and really got me emotional (I cried a little)
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#25
Cheers was just ok. Feels like a kind of a folksy 80s thing (whistful nostalgia is even baked into the opening titles)
But, since its been on heavy rotation as filler over here the past few years, I've come to think that Frasier is actually one of the all time great comedy series. It's literally classic in the sense that it carries the torch from older shows like The Mary Tyler Moore Show and things of that era.
Being about over educated upper class twits and their working class father and housekeeper gives it a touch of English flavor as well which solidifies it further. It also gets a chance to be intellectual and classy and about intellectual and classy things on ocassion without that being the punchline like it was mostly with Frasier and Lilith in Cheers (Yes, it is possible to laugh at Freud and Gilbert and Sullivan references without the joke being that no one knows who that is).
I find it a remarkably solid show from episode to episode, covering all these bases well while still coming up with good new comic scenarios that show off the timing of the cast and their physical performance chops. The only word I keep coming back to is "classic", with all that entails.

I guess no one cares if it doesn't make them laugh enough and that can't be helped I suppose. But I find its craft impresses me pretty regularly and it's almost always entertaining.
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#26
Fraiser was a great show but I think it lost a little something when Niles and Daphne finally got together.
"Every romantic comedy should just be called "Tryin' to Fuck" - Patton Oswalt
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#27
(10-01-2019, 09:25 PM)Bucho Wrote: I remember Different Strokes finishing its run and Cheers moving into that slot and me and my Different Strokes-loving brothers being all, "Awwwwww, maaaannnnn," and our old man being all, "Don't sweat it lads, you're going to love THIS show even more."

And he was right.

I remember as a kid watching stuff like Diff'rent Strokes and Facts of Life and even Three's Company and enjoying them fine at that point. But once I started getting into Cheers I immediately knew there was a lot more work going into that show. It was really the bridge to much better written comedy.
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#28
(10-01-2019, 11:37 PM)Paul755 Wrote: Fraiser was a great show but I think it lost a little something when Niles and Daphne finally got together.
It lost the same thing that Cheers lost when Shelly Long left and what MASH lost when Trapper John and Frank Burns left. Not something that killed the show by any means....but there was a very clear shift.

I think that Cheers felt more like a 70s show up until Diane left. Rebecca and Woody and the departure of Coach as well dragged it kicking and screaming into the late 80s/early 90s. It went from feeling like Taxi to a kind of proto-Seinfeld..
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#29
Alright, strange question for the Cheers-loving crowd. I'm trying to find a specific episode. I think it's in the beginning of Season 9 but I'm not entirely sure.

I can't remember much about the plot but I do remember Woody getting a hold of a bag of concrete (I believe) and saying, "Now what am I gonna make with this?"

Can someone help me pinpoint this episode?
"Nooj's true feelings on any given subject are unknown and unknowable. He is the butterfly flapping its wings in Peking. He is chaos and destruction and you shall never see his true form." - Merriweather

My Steam ID: yizashigreyspear
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#30
Damn Michael, I remember that but I couldn't tell you which episode it was.

That Cheers/Night Court hour had a big influence on me as I was developing my sense of humor as a kid, although Night Court's run of strong episodes was much smaller in the end.

And everyone's seen the greatest Halloween costume of all time, yes?

   
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#31
Always thought it was pretty cool that John Mahoney was living his life as an out but low-key gay man throughout the whole run of the show and after. (See also: John Spencer.)

Then again, I'm the guy who is shocked - to this day! - that John Mahoney was British.
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#32
Wait....Mahoney was British and gay?

For realz?
"Nooj's true feelings on any given subject are unknown and unknowable. He is the butterfly flapping its wings in Peking. He is chaos and destruction and you shall never see his true form." - Merriweather

My Steam ID: yizashigreyspear
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#33
The gay thing I knew. But British? I’m shocked!
If you're happy, you're not paying attention.

Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny: 
Glad that you guys worked that out amongst yourselves.

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#34
Huh. I didn't know either of those things, either. I'm trying to think of what I might have seen him in outside of Frasier and SAY ANYTHING. Good actor. "I'm incarcerated, Lloyd!"

There was a joke on Cheers where Frasier is getting wistful about not getting to spend enough time with his father before he died.

"He was always so busy with his experiments."
Woody (maybe Sam?): "Was he a scientist?"
"No, he was a white rat. Of course he was a scientist."

Grammer's delivery of "no, he was a white rat" was incredible. I was impressed that they addressed that exchange on the episode of Frasier where Sam guest stars, writing it away as Frasier just being angry at his dad after an argument.
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#35
We should just have a thread called "Boone Tells Michael (and friends!) Things They Didn't Know About Celebrities."

Gay: http://www.newnownext.com/why-i-didnt-ou...y/02/2018/ (This is just one of several articles written after his death. It seems like he was an intensely private guy - see British - so I don't think he was "out" per se. That was a mistake of wording on my part. But he also wasn't "closeted" either. The article from NNN goes into the ambiguous, private nature of the way he lived his life - again, fellow NBC star/working class hero John Spencer seemed to have been the same way. That said, when Mahoney passed, there was an embracing/acknowledgement of him as an LGBT actor from LGBT Twitter. Which is Twitter.)

British: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/tv/2018/02/0...edy-great/
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