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Falcon & The Winter Soldier on Disney+
Yeah, keep that fantasy stuff out of my show about a dude with mechanical wings and a cyborg thank you very much.
Originally Posted by ImmortanNick 

Saw Batman v Superman.
Now I know what it's like to see Nickelback in concert.

That's my review.
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(03-27-2021, 11:20 AM)slim Wrote: Do mofos watch a John Wick movie and think John Wick has actual super powers? He must, because no actual human can do the things he does either.

Steve Rogers in the comics has no actual super powers, btw, and does almost all the same shit movie Cap does-- he's just peak human ability, all the time, supposedly. I think the MCU version is powered up beyond that just to set him above the heightened-reality, action-movie-level of a Widow or a Hawkeye. No human has the un-erring aim of Hawkeye, drawing a bow two times a second-- what's up with that? Is he a mutant or something? (No.)

How good at what he does did Sam Wilson have to be for the Air Force to gear him up with an experimental super science rocket pack? Good enough to also toss around a space magic shield, I'd guess.

Sure you can do that stuff. You know how I know? Because Keanu Reeves is out there actually doing the gun training and stunts. I can't speak to exactly HOW crazy those movies get, I haven't seen them all, but call me when John Wick throws a giant disc that bounces off three bad guys and comes flying back straight to him.

Like I said, internal consistency matters. Steve is shown in the MCU to absolutely be super affected by super soldier syrum. From strength, to reflexes and agility, to memory to intelligence. Him being so good with the shield makes logical sense in context. John Walker? Not at all.
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(03-27-2021, 04:48 PM)cd underbelly Wrote:
(03-27-2021, 01:23 AM)Chaz Rock City Wrote: So far this has been the best Stan has been in the role. He has great chemistry with Mackie. I liked his dry sense of humor; telling Sam he read The Hobbit in 1937 was clever. 

  I hope the series keeps the social commentary going.

   As of now I don't have a problem with Walker using the shield as if he was a super soldier, but I didn't buy that people would blindly accept a new Captain America. To quote Kurt Angle: "Where are his gold medals? Who did he ever beat?"

He uh, has three Medals of Honor.

  That is impressive but not in the same league as stopping The Red Skull, The Chitauri, Project Insight and Thanos.

While I know people can be easily mislead, I just didn't buy the GMA scene of thousnads of people accepting Walker as the new Captain America because they are being told to.
I've got good news and I've got bad news. The bad news is I've lost my way. The good news is I'm way ahead of schedule!
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I'll buy just about anything that suggests the populace is fickle, treacherous and above all, stupid.
Brigadier Cousins on PSN
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I have no idea where Freeman is getting the stuff about the serum giving Cap a photographic memory and boosted intelligence from. I don't recall anything in the movies suggesting that at all.
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(03-28-2021, 12:47 AM)schwartz Wrote: I have no idea where Freeman is getting the stuff about the serum giving Cap a photographic memory and boosted intelligence from. I don't recall anything in the movies suggesting that at all.

While behind enemy lines rescuing the soldiers, he gets a very brief glance at a Hydra map. He then rattles off to Tommy Lee Jones tiny details about all of that intel with almost total recall, and apologizes for any holes, "I only got a brief look."

Don't even play the game with me that tiny Steve had a highly advanced photographic memory.
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Tiny Steve certainly wasn't dumb, and the whole thing about him is that he is basically the Perfect Soldier, in every way not related to size.
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https://screenrant.com/captain-america-s...matched%22.

"The Super-Soldier Serum also enhanced Steve mentally: "His memory is near-photographic" and "his real-time analyzation and strategic planning ability are unmatched"."

This is straight from Marvel about the MCU.  The serum did that.  This next post is about Marvel comics and it references Black Widow(who in the comics has a form of serum in her and it confirms the same thing)

"The Super-Soldier Serum can also affects the brain, allowing individuals to retain and recall any information they take in, such as Captain America, who possesses enhanced mind and is capable of remembering any military tactic and can apply it to any situation.[42] The Super-Soldier Serum increase the individual's reflexes beyond those of normal humans and non-enhanced peak humans.[43] For example, Black Widow was able to dodge gunfire from Rapido's cybernetic arm.[43] The Super-Soldier Serum dramatically prevents individuals from aging due to the regeneration of healthy cells.[21][7] For instance, Dr. Kudrin has stated that Natasha "don't age as fast.""

Now what I would like you to do, is get down on your knees and BEG me for my forgiveness.

I shall consider it, as a superior specimen I am merciful.

AKA: JOHN WALKER CANNOT DO THIS SHIT
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[Image: giphy.gif]
If we can dream it, then we can do it.
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So what super powers does Sam have that make him a suitable heir to the shield? Or did Cap give it to him to be an accessory?
Just this guy, you know?
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I guess I just assumed John Walker had some form of super juice.

If not, eh, Black Widow's been a 'regular human' all this time as well.
Brigadier Cousins on PSN
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(03-28-2021, 02:00 AM)Richard Dickson Wrote: So what super powers does Sam have that make him a suitable heir to the shield?  Or did Cap give it to him to be an accessory?

Like I said, give him an arm magnet retrieval thing and the wing suit does the vast majority of making Sam look cool and letting him do these cool amazing kinetic things.  Obviously Cap gave him the shield thinking he would take up the mantle.  But that doesn't mean Sam can throw it like Cap did.  This is basically the same situation as "Robin" in TDKR taking over the bat cave.  Just because he's handed the gear doesn't make him Batman, he's gonna fucking DIE night 1.  

And like I said Arjen, if it is revealed Walker is full of shit and he IS on the juice(there's already plenty of super soldiers running around, it's plausible he's a liar) then I'm perfectly fine.  It makes sense.  

Also, given Widows origins in the comics, and the MCU's constant implications about the Red Room, it's very very plausible she has had her own kinds of super enhancement from the Russians and it just has never been exposited.  After all, 120 pound Widow obviously can't do... ANY of that in reality.

I was looking for footage of Walker throwing the shield training and all I found was this.



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(03-28-2021, 12:15 AM)Chaz Rock City Wrote:
(03-27-2021, 04:48 PM)cd underbelly Wrote:
(03-27-2021, 01:23 AM)Chaz Rock City Wrote: So far this has been the best Stan has been in the role. He has great chemistry with Mackie. I liked his dry sense of humor; telling Sam he read The Hobbit in 1937 was clever. 

  I hope the series keeps the social commentary going.

   As of now I don't have a problem with Walker using the shield as if he was a super soldier, but I didn't buy that people would blindly accept a new Captain America. To quote Kurt Angle: "Where are his gold medals? Who did he ever beat?"

He uh, has three Medals of Honor.

  That is impressive but not in the same league as stopping The Red Skull, The Chitauri, Project Insight and Thanos.

While I know people can be easily mislead, I just didn't buy the GMA scene of thousnads of people accepting Walker as the new Captain America because they are being told to.

This is the same country where a large mob violently stormed the government capitol because their president told them to. Never underestimate the ability of masses of stupid people to be easily swayed. Many Americans cheering on a new Cap because, "Hey look he's a good soldier with some accolaedes", isn't thst much of a stretch.

People are an ass.
Git' in under mah belly!
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(03-28-2021, 02:37 AM)cd underbelly Wrote: This is the same country where a large mob violently stormed the government capitol because their president told them to. Never underestimate the ability of masses of stupid people to be easily swayed. Many Americans cheering on a new Cap because, "Hey look he's a good soldier with some accolaedes", isn't thst much of a stretch.

People are an ass.

Yeah, I had absolutely no problem buying that at all.  And it's not like the entirety of the nation's opinion was firmly encapsulated in that single stadium.  I dunno if you've been paying attention the past few years, but people who are willing to believe what they want to will turn out to get behind it.  The ones who don't agree won't be found there.
Not a hard man to track. Leaves dead men wherever he goes.
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One TV spot of nuCap saying Cancel Culture is getting a bit out of control, and they're his forever.
Brigadier Cousins on PSN
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(03-19-2021, 11:53 PM)slim Wrote: Also, in the comics, the Avengers did draw a salary through the Maria Stark Foundation. Find it hard to believe that movie Tony didn't provide for something like that-- but, again, this serves the story better.

Falc was part of Cap's rogue group though, so he wouldn't have been drawing that sweet, sweet, Avengers cash.

(03-26-2021, 07:00 PM)MichaelM Wrote: Wyatt Russell has a weird face, man. And I don't think he's a particularly gifted actor. What's funny is just who he is in real life (plus my own subjective opinion on his acting talents) kind of make him the perfect guy for John Walker: a man who evokes the greatness that came before while also clearly not being equal to the task.


I bought him in EVERYBODY WANTS SOME and LODGE 49. He clearly isn't his dad or mom, but he's fine. I think if he stays in his lane he can do well.

(03-27-2021, 12:55 AM)the nz natural Wrote: For all the nitpicking about this and that, how come no one's asked a million questions about the properties of a vibranium disc?  What kind of density does it have that it can be thrown with force, but still retain it's momentum on return after impact?  That would be my questions more than "how can a human who they have explained as being of peak physical condition do this?!".  I mean, all things being equal with the shield physics, you telling me a peak physical athlete wouldn't have the reflexes to catch a returning object from what looked like 10-15 metres worth of heads up, after what sounded like a shit-tonne of prep and training time (which indicates the gubmint had plans for their handpicked replacement long before Sam even gave up the shield, which adds another layer to this narrative)?

If we're gonna pick nits, let's get right down to it...

The return thing is just "comic book rules" because it's essentially playing pool in 3D as far as the geometry of it, except you're moving, the balls are moving, as well as shooting at you. So it's pretty much impossible.

A Hawaiian shirt is like a cash gift - always appropriate
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[Image: rmdSx.gif]
If we can dream it, then we can do it.
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Walker’s totes on the juice, guys.
If I could change to liquid, I'd fill the cracks and bend the rocks.
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if he’s supposed to be on some kind of juice, it seems like Bucky and Sam should be all “he shouldn’t be able to do that”
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From last week’s AVClub comments

[attachment=7625]

Agreed, nooj, but the necessity of weekly episodes indicates that that info should be held off for now.

Or, more likely, he’ll hit the juice between next episode and the season’s end. I think we’ll learn he’s been on the juice from the get go, though.

He was good in Fievel Goes West.
If I could change to liquid, I'd fill the cracks and bend the rocks.
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(03-27-2021, 11:58 PM)freeman Wrote:
(03-27-2021, 11:20 AM)slim Wrote: Do mofos watch a John Wick movie and think John Wick has actual super powers? He must, because no actual human can do the things he does either.

Steve Rogers in the comics has no actual super powers, btw, and does almost all the same shit movie Cap does-- he's just peak human ability, all the time, supposedly. I think the MCU version is powered up beyond that just to set him above the heightened-reality, action-movie-level of a Widow or a Hawkeye. No human has the un-erring aim of Hawkeye, drawing a bow two times a second-- what's up with that? Is he a mutant or something? (No.)

How good at what he does did Sam Wilson have to be for the Air Force to gear him up with an experimental super science rocket pack? Good enough to also toss around a space magic shield, I'd guess.

Sure you can do that stuff.  You know how I know?  Because Keanu Reeves is out there actually doing the gun training and stunts. I can't speak to exactly HOW crazy those movies get, I haven't seen them all, but call me when John Wick throws a giant disc that bounces off three bad guys and comes flying back straight to him.  

Like I said, internal consistency matters.  Steve is shown in the MCU to absolutely be super affected by super soldier syrum.  From strength, to reflexes and agility, to memory to intelligence.  Him being so good with the shield makes logical sense in context.  John Walker?  Not at all.

The individual actions may be humanly possible, but if one guy walks into a joint to shoot it out with dozens of armed men *he is going to die*. Point is, that the "merely human" heroes in the MCU are operating in an action movie reality.

Wick probably isn't the most apt comparison though-- we don't hear these complaints about how Batman operates, who, we're repeatedly told, is also just a guy.
Our sanitariums are full of men who think they're Napoleon... Or God.
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Was there not some utterly and completely throwaway comment in the Walker package about his body was researched by scientists or something?

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(03-27-2021, 11:58 PM)freeman Wrote: Sure you can do that stuff.  You know how I know?  Because Keanu Reeves is out there actually doing the gun training and stunts. I can't speak to exactly HOW crazy those movies get, I haven't seen them all, but call me when John Wick throws a giant disc that bounces off three bad guys and comes flying back straight to him.  

Okay, just so we're clear here - people's bugbear here is that a metahuman could throw a steel disc and have it ricochet off three human meat-sacks, all while maintaining it's momentum AND being able to reverse the direction it spins in to alter it's path from target to target before ultimately returning to said metahuman . . . but a regular human couldn't because he just doesn't have the brute strength to throw it so hard that it negates all those other factors?
I mean, have we gotten to the point yet where people realise that debating fantasy elements only goes so far before you just have to either let it go or accept that this stuff isn't for them?
Not a hard man to track. Leaves dead men wherever he goes.
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Not only the brute strength but the enhanced tactical genius required to understand the tiny calculations required to know exactly where and how the shield is going to bounce. The MCU has firmly established that you need those factors to be as good with the shield as Cap is, there’s a literal happy hogan joke about what would happen if just anyone threw just any shield.

You keep trying to snarkily imply I’m REALLY reaching here and I’m clearly not. You see if anything this conversation is proof that a lot of you are the shits when it comes to paying attention in movies. “Where does it say cap has photographic memory??” Etc. Looks like I’m the only Cap round these here parts!!!
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(03-28-2021, 02:09 AM)arjen rudd Wrote: If not, eh, Black Widow's been a 'regular human' all this time as well.

[Image: de18dfb6a33f3b0349c334f6fa500d95.gif]


**It's okay to say something in the MCU makes no fucking sense, but that you like the MCU anyway.  It's fine.  Armageddon is ridiculous on so many levels it's hard to keep track, but I find it a howlingly good time, anyway. I'm not going to sit here and try to defend obvious physics-goofs as being something other than what they are.

****If Captain Walker America doesn't have some variation of serum-esque-superpowers, that entire shield-throwing sequence is a mess not just according to "real life rules," but according to the MCU's own internal logic, such as it is.  I fully expect a reveal that some variation of the serum was administered to him, but that he and his sidekick are evil ... or at least morally questionable.

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I cannot stress enough how much widow is NOT a regular human in the Marvel lore. You can’t say “comic book logic just gives her a buff” when we have countless examples of regular women who are not Widow level.

If Amanda Nunez fought even average men in the UFC... the pound for pound greatest female fighter on Earth would get mangled and destroyed.
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Black Widow is not a regular woman. She’s not superpowered, but she’s an extraordinary specimen that can run/flip/kick circles around the bulk of humanity.  There are copious examples of “regular” mooks in every Bourne, Bond or M:I flick that can’t possibly compete with the prowess of those heroes too, but it  doesn’t mean they are Kryptonians.

And sure, Freeman, you’re not stretching at all to say the films have CLEARLY established that Cap is a super genius, despite your only evidence being one scene where he looked at a map real good, not a single other person in this thread full of MCU geeks knowing what you’re talking about, and several of the films after that map looking scene making the way his gears turn slower than the Starks and Banners of the squad an explicit part of his characterization.
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(03-28-2021, 08:23 PM)Overlord Wrote: I fully expect a reveal [...] that he and his sidekick are evil

If that's where the show ends up going (and it may well do so), then this recent episode's opening scene was an egregious bait-and-switch.

Walker would be much more interesting if he is what he appears to be: a well-meaning guy who ultimately probably just doesn't have the right stuff to be Cap.
If we can dream it, then we can do it.
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(03-28-2021, 09:13 PM)schwartz Wrote: Black Widow is not a regular woman. She’s not superpowers, but she’s an extraordinary specimen that can run/flip/kick circles around the bulk of humanity.  There are copious examples of “regular” mooks in every Bourne, Bond or M:I flick that can’t possibly compete with the prowess of those heroes too, but it  doesn’t mean they are Kryptonians.

And sure, Freeman, you’re not stretching at all to say the films have CLEARLY established that Cap is a super genius, despite your only evidence being one scene where he looked at a map real good, not a single other person in this thread full of MCU geeks knowing what you’re talking about, and several of the films after that map looking scene making the way his gears turn slower than the Starks and Banners of the squad an explicit part of his characterization.

First of all, Black Widow has a weaker version of the super soldier syrum in the comics. It would make sense if that is the case in the MCU.

Second, FUCKER, I pointed out the specific scene in question and then I posted articles from the comics and in relation to the MCU pointing out that stuff, but sure. Play stupid games. Win stupid prizes.

And also, do I REALLY have to explain why a Steve Rogers who is freshly woken up from a WW2 slumber not being able to keep up with seemingly random modern techo babble is not an indication of lack of intelligence? Why would strategic brilliance and photographic memory make him an expert on radiation or any of the shit Steve and Banner are going on about? Hmmmmmm?????
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“It’s IN THE COMICS!” does not at all mean it’s in the movies.
If I could change to liquid, I'd fill the cracks and bend the rocks.
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(03-28-2021, 09:25 PM)freeman Wrote:
(03-28-2021, 09:13 PM)schwartz Wrote: Black Widow is not a regular woman. She’s not superpowers, but she’s an extraordinary specimen that can run/flip/kick circles around the bulk of humanity.  There are copious examples of “regular” mooks in every Bourne, Bond or M:I flick that can’t possibly compete with the prowess of those heroes too, but it  doesn’t mean they are Kryptonians.

And sure, Freeman, you’re not stretching at all to say the films have CLEARLY established that Cap is a super genius, despite your only evidence being one scene where he looked at a map real good, not a single other person in this thread full of MCU geeks knowing what you’re talking about, and several of the films after that map looking scene making the way his gears turn slower than the Starks and Banners of the squad an explicit part of his characterization.

First of all, Black Widow has a weaker version of the super soldier syrum in the comics.  It would make sense if that is the case in the MCU.

Second, FUCKER, I pointed out the specific scene in question and then I posted articles from the comics and in relation to the MCU pointing out that stuff, but sure.  Play stupid games.  Win stupid prizes.

And also, do I REALLY have to explain why a Steve Rogers who is freshly woken up from a WW2 slumber not being able to keep up with seemingly random modern techo babble is not an indication of lack of intelligence?  Why would strategic brilliance and photographic memory make him an expert on radiation or any of the shit Steve and Banner are going on about?  Hmmmmmm?????

I dunno, man, why would a guy with a photographic memory need to keep a personal notepad to remind himself of concepts as simple as “pad thai” and “Trouble Man soundtrack”?
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He only remembers important shit?  The real answer is it's a gag for the audience that directly contradicts setup they did themselves in his first film.  It wouldn't be the first time.

Why do you keep fighting me on this?  You can literally go boot up The First Avenger RIGHT NOW and see the proof.  You can go see those articles I posted. But you insist on arguing instead.  You cannot win this!  You are Zod after I blew up your fancy Krypton maker device!
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(03-28-2021, 09:13 PM)schwartz Wrote: Black Widow is not a regular woman.
Correct. She can't have children, she's a monster.
“I call upon you to stop this musical now,” she said to the board. “You tear a community apart if you don’t.” -Prachi Ruina                                                            
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(03-28-2021, 09:42 PM)turingmachine75 Wrote: “It’s IN THE COMICS!” does not at all mean it’s in the movies.

[Image: giphy.gif]

Bluntly: I don't give a shit about what's in the comics WRT what's canon in the MCU. They're two separate things, and the MCU does not and should not need the comics for explanatory power.
"Nooj's true feelings on any given subject are unknown and unknowable. He is the butterfly flapping its wings in Peking. He is chaos and destruction and you shall never see his true form." - Merriweather

My Steam ID: yizashigreyspear
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This argument is some pretty good nerd shit you guys. Keep going.
Git' in under mah belly!
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