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When your relationship ends.
#36

It seems to me that both marriage and the concept of the long term exclusive relationship and the nuclear family are fighting a losing battle nowadays. They are concepts applicable to a society drastically different than our own.

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#37


Quote:
Originally Posted by stelios View Post

It seems to me that both marriage and the concept of the long term exclusive relationship and the nuclear family are fighting a losing battle nowadays. They are concepts applicable to a society drastically different than our own.



That is about the saddest most depressing thing I've read in a while.  But I can't deny the possibility.  I fought for my marriage, through infidelity and the whole civil roommate thing (great phrase Darkmite btw).  Mostly because I grew up without a father (not his fault he died) and couldn't bear to make my children suffer that. Eventually it just wasn't enough, and everything I knew in my adult life-met my husband at 20-changed.  However, I still have hope that the ideal, a marriage that lasts, still is possible.  Keep the hope alive man!

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#38

Edited because I edited the wrong post.

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#39


Quote:
Originally Posted by Verber View Post

and the whole civil roommate thing (great phrase Darkmite btw).

It's kind of sad/amusing how both definitions of the word "civil" apply here.

- of the ordinary life and affairs of citizens
- complacently respectful

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#40

That really reminds me of Ethan Hawke's description of his marriage in Before Sunset.  "Running a nursery with a good friend."

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#41

Dear breakup dudes: I know I haven't posted here in a while, but read over my stuff in that one relationship thread that someone else linked. Also, go out and get some rebound fucking out of your system tout de suite. This does not necessarily apply to Sebastian, who is one of the best guys and has trooped through some really horrible, depressing shit over the past few months and is an even more awesome person for having done so. FB me if you want to get a drink sometime, sir, my treat.

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#42

My sympathies to RD and Sebastian, we don't see eye to eye but you both have had a shitty fucking hand dealt.

I had a particularly nasty break up about two years ago, and the thing I found that really helped was a book called 'Things The Grandchildren Should Know' by Mark Oliver Everett. It's an autobiography and I found it kind of inspiring and comforting largely because it detailed how Oliver Everett used these shitty, terrible, experiences in his life to create his art, but never made it overly inspirational. It's a painful, angry, book, but it's fascinating to me.

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#43

My sincerist sympathies Sebastian.

I cant stress enough the need to keep yourself busy RD its what got me through my last big breakup.  But Jake is also right, the whole rebound shag also works a treat.

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#44

Rain Dog: Let ou whatever's inside, because you DO NOT want to carry that shit into your next relationship.  Next, you need to keep busy DOING THINGS THAT MAKE YOU TRULY HAPPY.  Don't just do something for the sake of doing it, because you won't enjoy it and it will only remind you of why you're doing it.  You need to make yourself well again.  When you are ready to get back in the dating game, do it.  Not a moment beforehand, no matter what your friends say, no matter whether they say they "found a nice girl", NO NO NO.  If you're not ready, you're not ready.  Spend a lot of time with your friends.  They make you feel good.  They support you.  They love you, if they are indeed friends.  Friends help a lot.

Sebastian: I am so deeply, deeply sorry, and I just said a prayer for you.  I hope you're surrounded by people who love you, truly.

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#45

Man, that sucks, RD. I agree with what others have said. You'll go through the stages of grief. That's totally normal. Don't dwell on it. Let yourself feel your feelings but don't dwell on it.  Find good happy distractions and spend a lot of time with friends. It will get better.

And Sebastian -- I can't imagine what you're going through. My belated condolences and sympathies. My thoughts are with you.

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#46

I'm probably a lot younger (20) than most people here, so maybe my wisdom isn't quite as sage, but I'd like to throw out the seemingly backwards advice that you should try to actually relish this period of trauma and heartbreak as best you can, because it will fade and, just like the quote from Swingers, you'll bizarrely find yourself missing it. This is partially because you lived with it so long, but also because the whole experience of the break-up will become part of the crazy amalgam of memories dreams and reflections that form your life. I, for one, can say I feel glad about the periods of loss I've endured simply because going through life sealed away in an airless bubble of bliss is boring, and things need to be shaken up in order to guarantee that your life will be one of continuous forward movement and personal development.

So my fairly inexperienced advice (I had one 4-year relationship fall on its face about a year ago, and that's the extent of my knowledge) would be to enjoy the opportunity to bask in misery and loss and seize the chance to stake your claim on those emotional lows. Then, when you come out the other side, you'll be that much more conscious of the tremendous variety of emotional experiences we petty humans are able to access and how you, individually, respond(ed) to them. Good luck, man.

I'll also echo the sympathy for Sebastian. A terrible personal tragedy to be sure. I am very sorry for your loss.

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#47

I thnk that is your youth speaking, without meaning to sound like some asshole knowitall older guy (and I'm twice your age). I think allowing the feelings to come, acknowledging them, and doing what RD (and Sebastian) can to channel that energy into something more positive and forward thinking is good. Relishing/wallowing in the grief isn't healthy; it's like inviting deeper and more prolonged hurt. Bad breakups hurt enough all by themselves. I don't think it's going to benefit RD (or anyone) to take some kind of weird joy in the pain.

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#48

Haha yeah, I wasn't entirely suggesting he take weird joy in it. It's just helpful to recognize that it's kind of a unique experience of its own, although obviously not a happy one, and try to absorb what that entails. I'm not encouraging anybody to find masochistic glee in a break-up, for the record. lol

Edit: And I do of course think most of the other advice here is very useful in a more pragmatic day-to-day sense, especially Bucho's post (and it's all certainly more useful than most of the advice I sought out on the internet at that time).

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#49

Rain Dog, you seem like a really awesome guy judging by your posts. What you're going through is really shitty and a bunch of other posters with tons more intelligence and experience than me have already given you some really great advice. However, if you're willing to listen to some as idiotic as me, in addition to the much better advice posted earlier in the thread I'd recommend listening to "Now you're a Man" from the Orgazmo soundtrack while breaking things.

Sebastian, I'm so sorry. I know there's no way I can really comprehend the depth and magnitude of your loss. I wish I was a bit more poetic or intelligent so I could perhaps say something meaningful. Nevertheless I can only offer you my deepest sympathies for your loss.

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#50

First, condolences to everyone here who's lost someone or is going through the pain of separation. I'm divorced, and have never re-married, and never intend to.

Second, I'll do the kindest thing I can possibly do: I won't give you any advice at all.

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#51

Thank you everyone for the condolences. You are all good people in my book, even if we sometimes disagree.

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#52

So heya guys. Thought I'd pop back in with a minor update on my situation these days for those that are interested.

Wow, it's been a pretty intense, soul-searching couple of months thats for sure. My ex has now moved all but a few things out, she still comes by while I'm at work to walk our dogs. Sorry - MY dogs. I haven't seen her in the flesh yet, we're doing our best to give each other the space we need. We're in pretty regular email contact and are still sorting out the seperation of financials and all that shit, but really, it feels like the hardest is behind me now. God I hope so anyway. Maybe I'll have some relapse, something unforseen will happen and I'll slide back, but at the moment I'm having more okay days than bad ones. I'll take that. That's also helpful as my work is a nightmare right now so my stress levels are taking a pounding from that end anyway.

I've even got a few young ladies showing an interest - being single in the age of social networking is one helluva different experience to the last time I was single a decade ago - the level of ease with which you can now put yourself out there is staggering for us old enough to remember days of hastily written phone numbers on hands in sweaty nightclubs. While the attention is nice for the self esteem, I have absolutely no interest in going straight back into another relationship. I've been given this least-looked-for opportunity at the single life while I still have a modicum of my youth and god damn it I'm going to use it. Hell I've even had my libido come roaring back to life, I feel about sixteen again in that regard. It's insane.

Now I have to start writing again, get my juices flowing. That's seeming harder than I anticipated, but I'm going to force myself to do some soon.

All in all fellas I'm getting there. I want to thank each and every one of you for what it's worth. This thread was a real comfort to me in the early days and chud in general has been a lifeline to keep my mind off the crazy both at home and work.

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#53

Happy to hear it, RD.

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#54

Thanks nooj my man. It's weird, I actually think my ex is struggling a lot more now than I am. She's got a lot of guilt that she's carrying with her and anxiety about the future and it's really wearing her down right now. I know I can't take that onboard too much - she's made her bed etc. - but since there's no anger or bitterness I can't help but feel for her. It was her birthday on Monday and it was really hard knowing she was miserable.

Anyway its weird, that I'm the one seemingly getting better and she's stuck being miserable.

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#55

Glad to hear you're flying a bit more wings-level lately RD. There could be more turbulence up ahead, especially when she does start seeing someone else, but yeah, it's good to hear the worst of the storm is behind you.

Man, what's with all those metaphors? I guess that Red Tails trailer really got to me.

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#56

You're a good man for caring for her current state-of-being.

But I don't know her, and I'm not a good man.  So allow me to do this for you.

http://iusedtohavehair.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/mr-burns-evil-laugh.png?w=260

(I hope her situation improves soon)

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#57

Glad to hear it Rain Dog.

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#58


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bucho View Post

Glad to hear you're flying a bit more wings-level lately RD. There could be more turbulence up ahead, especially when she does start seeing someone else, but yeah, it's good to hear the worst of the storm is behind you.

Man, what's with all those metaphors? I guess that Red Tails trailer really got to me.


Is this advice for me or Biggles?

(thanks Bucho and everyone)

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#59

Quote:
Now I have to start writing again, get my juices flowing. That's seeming harder than I anticipated, but I'm going to force myself to do some soon.

This.  In the midst of my divorce a decade ago, I had moved into a new place and started to work out the beginnings of a new life.  Funny how my life fit in so much a smaller space (one bedroom) than it had used to.  Anyway, I thought that I'd have a great opportunity to play more guitar, write more songs, etc.  And I did some of that.  But WAY less than I had intended.  Most evenings I would pick up my guitar or turn on my computer to do some recording and just....not.  There was a block of some sort.  Like I had misplaced the reason for it all, maybe.

Force yourself.  Just do it.  In small pieces.  If you're going to write, write one thing.  One measly thing.  Tomorrow, use that one thing as a starting point to write the next measly thing.  Do it.  Don't think about it.  Don't feel about it.  Just do the damn thing.

For me, the thing that moved me past the block was a Ted Greene lesson book.  Insanely detailed and difficult.  But I forced myself to work through it one exercise at a time.  I never quite made it all the way through, though.  Eventually I was asked to join a band and there was a reason.

Don't think.  Do.  And we'd love to see what you come up with.

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#60


Quote:
Originally Posted by teledork View Post

This.  In the midst of my divorce a decade ago, I had moved into a new place and started to work out the beginnings of a new life.  Funny how my life fit in so much a smaller space (one bedroom) than it had used to.  Anyway, I thought that I'd have a great opportunity to play more guitar, write more songs, etc.  And I did some of that.  But WAY less than I had intended.  Most evenings I would pick up my guitar or turn on my computer to do some recording and just....not.  There was a block of some sort.  Like I had misplaced the reason for it all, maybe.

Force yourself.  Just do it.  In small pieces.  If you're going to write, write one thing.  One measly thing.  Tomorrow, use that one thing as a starting point to write the next measly thing.  Do it.  Don't think about it.  Don't feel about it.  Just do the damn thing.

For me, the thing that moved me past the block was a Ted Greene lesson book.  Insanely detailed and difficult.  But I forced myself to work through it one exercise at a time.  I never quite made it all the way through, though.  Eventually I was asked to join a band and there was a reason.

Don't think.  Do.  And we'd love to see what you come up with.


Thanks mate. With any luck Nick and Eleanor will have me back at Guy.com and I can give myself a proper focus again. I loved being that sites token antipodean.

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#61

This.

Quote:
Originally Posted by teledork View Post

Don't think.  Do.  And we'd love to see what you come up with.



And really glad to hear you're working through this.

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#62

Sorry to hear the news, but glad things are picking up for you Rain Dog. "Time heals all wounds" is the cheesiest cliche in the world because it's true.

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#63


Quote:
Originally Posted by The Rain Dog View Post

Thanks nooj my man. It's weird, I actually think my ex is struggling a lot more now than I am. She's got a lot of guilt that she's carrying with her and anxiety about the future and it's really wearing her down right now. I know I can't take that onboard too much - she's made her bed etc. - but since there's no anger or bitterness I can't help but feel for her. It was her birthday on Monday and it was really hard knowing she was miserable.

Anyway its weird, that I'm the one seemingly getting better and she's stuck being miserable.



Feeling bad for her isn't bad.  You wouldn't be human if you didn't.  But you need to keep that shit to yourself, as in, do not talk to her about that.  Talking about feeling sympathy will turn into a talk about feelings that will lead down a really confusing emotional rabbit hole.  I've had a very good friend get roped back into a really bad relationship because she felt bad for the ex because he was lonely.  A bunch of us had a come-to-your-fucking-senses chat with her before she got out for good.

Keep feeling better, man.

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#64

If you're really secure about your feelings RD, keep some sort of an eye on her. Not in person and preferably not with her knowledge but try. Relationships unavoidably turn to shit, for a variety of reasons and degrees of culpability but we're still human beings who used to care for each other in the end. Choosing what to do is not going to be easy and maybe put you in a precarious position but what thing about relationships isn't dangerous or difficult?

Or maybe I'm just being a sap.

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#65


Quote:
Originally Posted by stelios View Post

If you're really secure about your feelings RD, keep some sort of an eye on her. Not in person and preferably not with her knowledge but try. Relationships unavoidably turn to shit, for a variety of reasons and degrees of culpability but we're still human beings who used to care for each other in the end. Choosing what to do is not going to be easy and maybe put you in a precarious position but what thing about relationships isn't dangerous or difficult?

Or maybe I'm just being a sap.


No you;re not mate. Not at all. This is kinda what I'm trying to do. Touching base with her via email, that sort of thing. I mean shit, I loved this woman more than I have anyone in my life for ten years, that shit can't just be turned off.

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#66

Just have to be careful and put YOUR feelings first. Stelios is so right, in that you have to be pretty damn secure in your feelings. And I think keeping things to e-mail is pretty safe, but you'll have to wean yourself off even that eventually.

I've fallen in love twice, and had the heart break twice. The first the girl moved across the country, and we kept in contact. But to this day she still calls/texts when she's fighting depression, and I get the whole "I wish I hadn't moved, we might still be together" moments......which is tough as I would give anything to be with her, but I'd also love to be rich and that ain't happening. So it's good to hear from her and care about her, but it also brings up that heartache a few times a year.

The other was someone who said she was in love with 2 people, but chose the other. Nothing I could do about that, and I cut all ties. I miss her in my life, but I have no doubt it was the best decision for their relationship, and in allowing me to move on.

Just remember that SHE walked away, so be sure to put YOU first. That's all that matters.

Good luck dude. Way to stay strong.

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#67

Reading through this thread has given me plenty of solace. My condolences to Sebastian and good luck to you, Rain Dog.

I just got out of a relationship with a woman who was in the process of getting a divorce. I guess the phrase, "It ain't over 'til it's over," applies here; she went back to her husband rather unexpectedly. I thought there was no salvaging her marriage or I'd never have gone out with her in the first place. He'd cheated on her for a year with her best friend. And she'd told me more than once that she'd never take him back. So, apart from the fact she was still legally married, it was the happiest, healthiest relationship I'd been in since...well, ever. Maybe that's saying something about me.

Everything happened very quickly, but it all just felt right. Waking up next to her seemed like the most natural thing in the world. I was finally in a relationship where I felt completely at ease, like I was with someone who brought out the best in me, someone I felt truly honored to be in a relationship with. It didn't seem like a disaster in the making, or two people running away from something -- the kind of relationships I was used to.

She was beautiful, she was kind, she was the kind of girl that made me step up my game. Losing her to her awful husband was a punch to the gut. I'd have done anything for her and was falling madly in love with her, but she left me for a guy who'd betrayed her. It was baffling to me. That she'd throw the rest of her life away out of some bizarre obligation to him (she brought up "the sanctity" of her marriage during her breakup speech) is a crime.

My life is back to the way it was before we met, but it still feels significantly diminished. Before I met Brie, I had sort of gotten used to the idea of being single and in my 30s. I'd come to terms with bachelorhood, as it seems to be my natural state. I'd been a serial dater, never really committing, just playing the field. Then I got a glimpse of something that was almost perfect. And now that's over. Now I'm not sure what I want.

So that's where I'm at.

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#68

Fucking 'sanctity'...

I'm sorry to hear that, Bradito.  And glad to hear that you're doing ok.

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#69


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradito View Post

Reading through this thread has given me plenty of solace. My condolences to Sebastian and good luck to you, Rain Dog.

I just got out of a relationship with a woman who was in the process of getting a divorce. I guess the phrase, "It ain't over 'til it's over," applies here; she went back to her husband rather unexpectedly. I thought there was no salvaging her marriage or I'd never have gone out with her in the first place. He'd cheated on her for a year with her best friend. And she'd told me more than once that she'd never take him back. So, apart from the fact she was still legally married, it was the happiest, healthiest relationship I'd been in since...well, ever. Maybe that's saying something about me.

Everything happened very quickly, but it all just felt right. Waking up next to her seemed like the most natural thing in the world. I was finally in a relationship where I felt completely at ease, like I was with someone who brought out the best in me, someone I felt truly honored to be in a relationship with. It didn't seem like a disaster in the making, or two people running away from something -- the kind of relationships I was used to.

She was beautiful, she was kind, she was the kind of girl that made me step up my game. Losing her to her awful husband was a punch to the gut. I'd have done anything for her and was falling madly in love with her, but she left me for a guy who'd betrayed her. It was baffling to me. That she'd throw the rest of her life away out of some bizarre obligation to him (she brought up "the sanctity" of her marriage during her breakup speech) is a crime.

My life is back to the way it was before we met, but it still feels significantly diminished. Before I met Brie, I had sort of gotten used to the idea of being single and in my 30s. I'd come to terms with bachelorhood, as it seems to be my natural state. I'd been a serial dater, never really committing, just playing the field. Then I got a glimpse of something that was almost perfect. And now that's over. Now I'm not sure what I want.

So that's where I'm at.



That's shit Bradito, but maybe in the long run you'll see this as a positive turning point, in that being with this woman awoke you're heart to the fact that maybe you want a little more out of your thirties emotionally speaking than perpetual bachelorhood?

Hang in there mate. Vent if and when you need to.

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#70



Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradito View Post

 Losing her to her awful husband was a punch to the gut. I'd have done anything for her and was falling madly in love with her, but she left me for a guy who'd betrayed her. It was baffling to me. That she'd throw the rest of her life away out of some bizarre obligation to him (she brought up "the sanctity" of her marriage during her breakup speech) is a crime.

My life is back to the way it was before we met, but it still feels significantly diminished. Before I met Brie, I had sort of gotten used to the idea of being single and in my 30s. I'd come to terms with bachelorhood, as it seems to be my natural state. I'd been a serial dater, never really committing, just playing the field. Then I got a glimpse of something that was almost perfect. And now that's over. Now I'm not sure what I want.

So that's where I'm at.


I went thru this exact same thing in 2004/5*, so I know of the pain and despair you feel because it seems she made a chocie, and chosen the evil husband, as some rational, logical choice.

She didn't. She went back, because frankly, that's her dealing with the pain of their break up. She is choosing to be miserable, because deep down, she feels insecure.

You should exorcise her from all parts of your life, (the advice in the thread for dealing with heartbreak may well help). As TRD said above, this could have some +ve effects in time, this was also the first time I'd been in love, and after the mourning period (including lots of crying, if I'm honest) I found love again.

* six months after going back to him, on the Saturday before xmas 2005, he dumped her for the final time. Via Facebook message. That, gentelmen and ladies, is known as Karma.  

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