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THE PUNISHER (NETFLIX)
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Originally Posted by Evi View Post
 


It'd be pretty cool if Castle is following some giant conspiracy but discovers it was all a random wrong-place wrong-time thing like in Memento, and then despite that continues murdering people. Because fuck it, that's who he is.



I really, really, really, really want this to happen now.




Quote:

Originally Posted by Bartleby_Scriven View Post
 

Yeah, aside from Karen popping up this appears to be its own thing. And please, please let it be its own thing.



No Claire moralizing sessions. "How do you know what you're doing is the right thiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnnnnnnnggggggggg?" immediately followed by, "THIS CITY NEEDS YOU!!!"



It's like I said, we had all that in Daredevil and we saw Frank's very definitive answer in the form of multiple gunshots. I'm kind of expecting Karen to come round to his view this go around actually.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Codename View Post
 


Are you referring to The Immortal Iron Fist? Protector of K'un-Lun? Sworn enemy of The Hand?




No, Whiny Western White Wguy.

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Oh right of course.



It's difficult to know, cause he never tells you explicitly who he is. Not even multiple times to the point of parody...

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ADamn. That trailer was better than THE DEFENDERS. Brutally enticing.
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I can google it, but does anyone know the release date? That stylized bit in the trailer for the date was gibberish...unless there is no date beyond 2017?

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They're being purposely cryptic. Good bet it goes up in November.

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AGood way to spend Thanksgiving. Get your mother-in-law all boozed up and sit her down in front of Frank.
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Are we seeing Castle straight up murdering federal police? Holy shit.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Amos Orange View Post
 

Are we seeing Castle straight up murdering federal police? Holy shit.


I...doubt it's that clear?  That would certainly be a huge departure for the character.

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It would be unless he's doing what he did in Valley Forge, Valley Forge, where he deployed precision and non-lethals to get around killing members of a SpecOps team that were sent after him.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny View Post
 

It would be unless he's doing what he did in Valley Forge, Valley Forge, where he deployed precision and non-lethals to get around killing members of a SpecOps team that were sent after him.


Well yes, but that wouldn't be straight-up murdering them.

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AI want to run through a brick wall after watching that trailer. So excited.
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But, uh... didn't he uncover the whole conspiracy about what happened to his family in Daredevil season 2?



It was the DA who chose not to clear the area of civilians while trying to operate a sting on the "Blacksmith" who turned out to be Castle's commander in the marines.


I hate to be that guy, but are they doing a retcon on Daredevil, or are they just choosing to ignore it like Iron Fist did?

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A[quote name="Amos Orange" url="/community/t/155441/the-punisher-netflix/100#post_4366680"]Are we seeing Castle straight up murdering federal police? Holy shit.
[/quote]

The seem to be nondescript special forces, probably mercenaries.
And Castle has no problem killing crooked cops or military, like he did in Daredevil.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by D.T. View Post
 

But, uh... didn't he uncover the whole conspiracy about what happened to his family in Daredevil season 2?



It was the DA who chose not to clear the area of civilians while trying to operate a sting on the "Blacksmith" who turned out to be Castle's commander in the marines.


I hate to be that guy, but are they doing a retcon on Daredevil, or are they just choosing to ignore it like Iron Fist did?


Yeah. As soon as they show his wife getting shot in his house I was all 'wait, what? That's...not his origin as established in Daredevil. Maybe it's a nightmare sequence or something' and then they continue with the 'they killed my family to get to me' and it's just 'WHAT IS GOING ON?! THAT'S NOT WHAT HAPPENED.'

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Been out all day with a headache. This is the first thing I see once most of the pain cleared.   I feel so goddamn better now.



I know that Netflix has been tricky before and after a great trailer a show has been a letdown, but keep in mind that Bernthal GETS the Punisher.  After seeing him at ECCC last year, talking about this character, he completely gets it.  This show will be glorious.

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I'm torn, as I usually am, between the scary douchebags who are a fan of this character, and the nasty little animal inside of me that just wants to watch the fuck out of Frank Castle killing some trash.



Nothing ever changes when it comes to this character.

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AYou can be a fan of a character without thinking them worthy of admiration.

Castle is interesting. His psychological damage, the trauma he experiences, his visceral reactions. These things make him somewhat relatable and fascinating to behold. And yes, watching utter bastards be victim to his unholy retributions is enjoyable to watch.

That doesn't mean you are suddenly fully in support of vigilante violence or crazed gunmen in the streets.

As long as someone doesn't want to BE Frank Castle, it's all good. And if they do, they've got fucking issues.
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ACrooked cops are like nazis: you don't feel too bad when they get shot.
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It's amusing how much better this looks than the similarly-themed Death Wish remake trailer.

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Yeah, but it's no War Zone!

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Farsight View Post
 

Yeah, but it's no War Zone!


Still quite possibly the most fun cinematic experience of my life...seeing Punisher: War Zone on opening night in a virtually empty theater while more than a little bit tipsy.

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AI've cooled on War Zone over the years. It's fun in its way, but I'm not sure if the Marvel Knights tone with MAX-level grue quite works the way they intended. I was also never happy with their adaptation of any of the Ennis characters outside of Detective Soap and it bothered me that Castle is declared a "hero" at the end.
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Please Pleaaasse let there be no comic book bullshit in this.



Pleeeeeeease.

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It's based on a comic book, Ska.



Skaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.



SKA.



Ska, it's based on a comic book.

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I'd really, really be interested in seeing Ennis asked to write an episode or two. Maybe like how George R.R. Martin used to write one episode of Game of Thrones a season for the first four.

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SAAAAXON



Remember what happened in the second half of Daredevil S2?



Remember what happened in the second half of Luke Cage?



REMEMBER WHAT HAPPENED IN THE DEFENDERS?




I don't have an issue with ridiculous comic book stuff so long as the tooooone supports it. Like I fucking love Warren Ellis'  Nextwave. I don't mind goofy shit. It's just when it feels like it's shoved in because the writers backed themselves into a corner and "let's let him fight Ninjas and shit" is the only viable outcome, that's when my bullshit alarm goes off.



So...I don't want any superhero bullshit in my Punisher.

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Frank-ly, I'd sooner this be set out of continuity with the rest of the MCU, but I know that's not possible. My only hope is that they acknowledge it even less than Daredevil does. I know it's difficult to ignore the destructive activities of aliens and extra-dimensional warlords and whatnot, but that's what I'd like.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny View Post
 

Frank-ly, I'd sooner this be set out of continuity with the rest of the MCU, but I know that's not possible. My only hope is that they acknowledge it even less than Daredevil does. I know it's difficult to ignore the destructive activities of aliens and extra-dimensional warlords and whatnot, but that's what I'd like.



Heh, the Punisher really does seem like a stupid asshole to be going after thugs when aliens and sentient AIs are trying to take over the world every few months.



"Frank, we need your help. An army of super mutants is loose in Central Park!"



"Fuck off, I just saw a guy shoplift AND jaywalk! My dance card is full!"




Quote:

Originally Posted by JacknifeJohnny View Post

I've cooled on War Zone over the years. It's fun in its way, but I'm not sure if the Marvel Knights tone with MAX-level grue quite works the way they intended. I was also never happy with their adaptation of any of the Ennis characters outside of Detective Soap and it bothered me that Castle is declared a "hero" at the end.


Do not go full hipster on War Zone. It remains awesome, and I'd wager money that in three months it's still the best version of the character ever put to film.

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Eh, I still have a serious soft spot for the Dolph Lundgren version. Yeah, they stripped away some of the aesthetic (though I do like the knife with the skull pommel) and the origin is kind of blah and the movie is kind of lacking itself, but I do kind of enjoy Lundgren's dead pan, i.e., he couldn't really act, version of Frank and it has some nice action and it's fun in a very sub-prime B-movie kind of way. It's a good, cheap, 80's Punisher movie before they figured out (maybe) how to really make him work on screen (It only took 25+ years). I haven't even seen the Thomas Jane one because I'm not feeling The Punisher fighting John Travolta in Florida, playing mind games with criminals instead of just immediately murdering them like he should be doing, or Rebecca Romijn (who I like) as the souped-up fantasy version of "Joan the Mouse".

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Jane's Punisher blows up a lot full of cars to form the image of a skull with their burning wreckage.



It -might- be possible to make a worse Punisher film, but there will never be a dumber one.

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There are elements I've liked about all of the live action depictions of the character.



I owned the Dolph Lundgren Punisher on VHS in the early 90's before I'd encountered his comic-book counterpart and, whilst it has flaws, they almost nail the main character. He's not as unhinged as John Bernthal's version but you see him leaving people to be stretched to death and blowing away bad guys by the dozen, whilst his final warning to a small boy that he'll come back and murder him if he steps out of line is 100% Frank Castle.



2004's The Punisher is probably the worst of the three movies both in its tone (it's aaaalll over the place) and in its portrayal of the central character who never comes across as unhinged or dangerous; merely annoyed. Still, I love the fight with The Russian in that movie and Travolta makes a good enough antagonist that I'll spend some time with it occasionally.... even if I can't really forgive a Punisher movie where Frank Castle tortures someone with a fucking popsicle.



Punisher: War Zone is definitely my favorite of the three movies, for Ray Stevenson's portrayal if nothing else. The guy feels dangerous as fuck; so much so that even the supporting characters look uncomfortable in his presence. As good as Bernthal was in his first appearance, he never quite reached the levels of intensity that Stevenson achieved in War Zone. Stevenson's not playing a hero or even an anti-hero; he's an out-and-out psychopath.



I'm hoping that'll change with this show, though, because I feel as though Bernthal was largely held back previously by the Daredevil show around him. You don't really see him doing that much actual punishing in the second season of Daredevil, whereas this trailer seems to be promising that won't be the case here. I'm looking forward to seeing Bernthal expanding on what we've already seen because the foundations are definitely there for possibly the best portrayal of the character yet, if Netflix gives him the resources to do so.

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AIt's weird to me that Bernthal's Punisher would bother spray-painting the skull on his stuff. It's such a comic-booky thing to do and while it works for the likes of Daredevil because he's looking to make a symbol out of himself, Castle's straight up just offing people for revenge here.

A logo isn't necessary when you're operating for entirely personal reasons...
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They go out of their way to establish the skull in season 2.  In character for you or not, they explained where he's coming from.



Plus it looks cool as fuuuuuuuck.

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A[quote name="D.T." url="/community/t/155441/the-punisher-netflix/100#post_4367516"]It's weird to me that Bernthal's Punisher would bother spray-painting the skull on his stuff. It's such a comic-booky thing to do and while it works for the likes of Daredevil because he's looking to make a symbol out of himself, Castle's straight up just offing people for revenge here.

A logo isn't necessary when you're operating for entirely personal reasons...[/quote]

Doing the skull is always going to feel a little incongruous with the way he's generally portrayed, but you kind of have to do it now and get it out of the way. Are you familiar with the death's head Ace of Spades playing card that went around Vietnam and maybe Korea? It was placed on the bodies of enemies as a psyops thing. I think of it like that. He's a soldier on a mission and like the Ace of Spades was for real-life soldiers, it's his calling card to the enemy. He's just some guy witb a gun until you see the skull, and once you see the skull, you know there's no conversation and no negotiation. You know you're fucked.

Here it is:

[IMG ALT=""]http://www.chud.com/community/content/type/61/id/247449/width/500/height/1000[/IMG]
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